Alternative Energy

[Gary Oak]

Does this Tim Fox want to live a long life ? If so I suspect that this will not get too well used. I am of the belief that there have been literally scads of far more fuel efficient or cleaner fuels discovered that the oil cartels have bought the patents for. Here we have fuel made from carbon dioxide and water.The oil cartels aren't going to let that crash the high gas prices they are scamming the world with





http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/ho">http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/ho ... 17382.html

[cc]

Most " Alternative Energy" cannot exist without massive subsidies = it should NOT exist.



It is no secret that President Obama's and green-energy supporters' (from both parties) foray into venture capitalism has not gone well. But the extent of its failure has been largely ignored by the press. Sure, single instances garner attention as they happen, but they ignore past failures in order to make it seem like a rare case.



The truth is that the problem is widespread. The government's picking winners and losers in the energy market has cost taxpayers billions of dollars, and the rate of failure, cronyism, and corruption at the companies receiving the subsidies is substantial. The fact that some companies are not under financial duress does not make the policy a success. It simply means that our taxpayer dollars subsidized companies that would've found the financial support in the private market.



So far, 36 companies that were offered federal support from taxpayers are faltering — either having gone bankrupt or laying off workers or heading for bankruptcy. This list includes only those companies that received federal money from the Obama Administration's Department of Energy and other agencies. The amount of money indicated does not reflect how much was actually received or spent but how much was offered. The amount also does not include other state, local, and federal tax credits and subsidies, which push the amount of money these companies have received from taxpayers even higher.



The complete list of faltering or bankrupt green-energy companies:



    Evergreen Solar ($25 million)*

    SpectraWatt ($500,000)*

    Solyndra ($535 million)*

    Beacon Power ($43 million)*

    Nevada Geothermal ($98.5 million)

    SunPower ($1.2 billion)

    First Solar ($1.46 billion)

    Babcock and Brown ($178 million)

    EnerDel's subsidiary Ener1 ($118.5 million)*

    Amonix ($5.9 million)

    Fisker Automotive ($529 million)

    Abound Solar ($400 million)*

    A123 Systems ($279 million)*

    Willard and Kelsey Solar Group ($700,981)*

    Johnson Controls ($299 million)

    Schneider Electric ($86 million)

    Brightsource ($1.6 billion)

    ECOtality ($126.2 million)

    Raser Technologies ($33 million)*

    Energy Conversion Devices ($13.3 million)*

    Mountain Plaza, Inc. ($2 million)*

    Olsen's Crop Service and Olsen's Mills Acquisition Company ($10 million)*

    Range Fuels ($80 million)*

    Thompson River Power ($6.5 million)*

    Stirling Energy Systems ($7 million)*

    Azure Dynamics ($5.4 million)*

    GreenVolts ($500,000)

    Vestas ($50 million)

    LG Chem's subsidiary Compact Power ($151 million)

    Nordic Windpower ($16 million)*

    Navistar ($39 million)

    Satcon ($3 million)*

    Konarka Technologies Inc. ($20 million)*

    Mascoma Corp. ($100 million)



*Denotes companies that have filed for bankruptcy.



The problem begins with the issue of government picking winners and losers in the first place. Venture capitalist firms exist for this very reason, and they choose what to invest in by looking at companies' business models and deciding if they are worthy. When the government plays venture capitalist, it tends to reward companies that are connected to the policymakers themselves or because it sounds nice to "invest" in green energy.



The 2009 stimulus set aside $80 billion to subsidize politically preferred energy projects. Since that time, 1,900 investigations have been opened to look into stimulus waste, fraud, and abuse (although not all are linked to the green-energy funds), and nearly 600 convictions have been made. Of that $80 billion in clean energy loans, grants, and tax credits, at least 10 percent has gone to companies that have since either gone bankrupt or are circling the drain.

[Frost]

Those so called clean energy alternatives are usually pretty dirty when you look deep into them.

The manufacturing, the storage batteries, and you also still need the oil to make the plastics .

I have a gripe with Solar also, look how long it's been around, and you still cant afford it.

[Gary Oak]

No Shen li, it is you who is the stooge. Yes I know you are full on pro Fort Crack because your pimp is out being a slave but there have been many water engines devised. Solar energy isn't promoted as it can't be taxed very well. I have heard about many engines that have been invented that can run for a very long time on very little fuel and that the owners of these patents are always bought out by the oil cartels.

Gary, you are such a stooge. So-called renewable energy has been an ultra-expensive, 40 year waste. I'm talking wind and solar here. The world is awash in cheap plentiful oil. Oil has powered nation's wealth and our affluence. It also has thousands of applications. Sun and wind have one application only and even that they can't do well.

[Obvious Li]

No Shen li, it is you who is the stooge. Yes I know you are full on pro Fort Crack because your pimp is out being a slave but there have been many water engines devised. Solar energy isn't promoted as it can't be taxed very well. I have heard about many engines that have been invented that can run for a very long time on very little fuel and that the owners of these patents are always bought out by the oil cartels.

Gary, you are such a stooge. So-called renewable energy has been an ultra-expensive, 40 year waste. I'm talking wind and solar here. The world is awash in cheap plentiful oil. Oil has powered nation's wealth and our affluence. It also has thousands of applications. Sun and wind have one application only and even that they can't do well.

this crap has been around for decades.....there are a million engines out there that get great gas mileage....unfortunately the american consumer does not want to drive a little shitbox that gets 50 mpg but can't pull a sick whore off a pisspot......it has nothing to do with oil companies suppressing technology...as far as alternative technologies are concerned until they are cost competitive with hydrocarbon fuels they will never replace oil and gas....it's just that simple......Hydrogen has the best chance but most experts say we are still 50 years away from solving the 1:1 ratio puzzle it presents...so for the foreseeable future it's hydrocarbon based fuels that rule....

P.S......this ethanol bullshit will probably turn out to be the biggest scam ever perpetrated on consumers