EV's, Reliable Power, et al

[Frood]

They're in a roundabout manner demanding the culling of most of humanity.... but they don't think they'd be a good portion of it too..



A lot of average/meagre existence Conservatives over the decades were attacked for voting Right. They were told that the Right didn't care about them and it was stupid to not vote Democrat because Democrats were after outcomes for them, not process.



But as we see now, when the process goes out the door.... so do the positive outcomes.



No poor conservative voter ever said, I'm poor not because of my choices or luck of the draw.



But they would say "I'm conservative because that is the only way I can correct my situation and for those around me"..



Conservatives and Right leaning people own their own problems. Liberals, Leftists, and especially Progressives foist them on others.

[DKG]

It is all just magical leftist thinking which falls apart on the details.  The bastards are destroying electricity production in the U.S. by forcing power plants to close, they are removing hydroelectric dams, they won't build any nuclear power, but they rainbow wind and solar can't keep the lights on.p

That is where climate alartmist hypocrisy is so apparent. They want "renewable" energy, but oppose hydroelectric and nuclear.

[JOE]

One roblem with Electric Vehicles is whether there will be enough metals or minerals available to produce them in large quantities moving forward:



https://www.visualcapitalist.com/sp/how-mineral-supply-will-change-ev-forecasts/#:~:text=China%20is%20home%20to%20more,lithium%2Dion%20battery%20production%20capacity">https://www.visualcapitalist.com/sp/how ... 20capacity">https://www.visualcapitalist.com/sp/how-mineral-supply-will-change-ev-forecasts/#:~:text=China%20is%20home%20to%20more,lithium%2Dion%20battery%20production%20capacity.



Many of the metals and minerals needed are relatively rare, even quite scarce and could be depleted if they decide to ramp up production.



https://www.visualcapitalist.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/01/Suhanko-_-Content-2-The-Evolution-of-EVs-Feb-07.jpg">

[Herman]

Affordable, reliable electricity should be one of the first priorities of any government It is too dang important for prog experimentation.



https://www.kiteandkeymedia.com/videos/americas-electrical-grid-challenges-and-vulnerabilities-with-aging-infrastructure-power-outages-and-less-reliable-energy-sources/?fbclid=IwAR22G6uPdjeX_o5mtHpy6VYoVMgiMdCWbb3aoOx5JFRL4YfjiZ_Gw5H_Koc">https://www.kiteandkeymedia.com/videos/ ... Z_Gw5H_Koc">https://www.kiteandkeymedia.com/videos/americas-electrical-grid-challenges-and-vulnerabilities-with-aging-infrastructure-power-outages-and-less-reliable-energy-sources/?fbclid=IwAR22G6uPdjeX_o5mtHpy6VYoVMgiMdCWbb3aoOx5JFRL4YfjiZ_Gw5H_Koc

In the year 2000, there were fewer than two dozen major power disruptions in the United States. In 2020, there were 180.



From just 2013 to 2020, the length of time that Americans had to endure power outages more than doubled.



Over 2 million people without power during California's wildfire season in 2019.vi Even more in Texas during winter storms in 2021.vii Most of the state of Louisiana in the dark after a hurricane later that year.viii Rolling blackouts during a heat wave in the Pacific Northwest.



And those blackouts aren't just inconvenient; they're dangerous. As one utility consultant told the New York Times, "This is like brain surgery. You don't make mistakes. People die when you mess it up.



No pressure, guys.



So, why can't we keep the lights on? Well, there are a number of factors at work.



For one thing, a lot of our energy infrastructure is old. Really old. As in "some of it has been around for more than 100 years" old.xi And over 70 percent of the lines used for power transmission and distribution are approaching the end of their lifecycles.



ut here's where it gets weird: The grid is also getting less reliable ... because we're making it less reliable.



Here's how it works: America's electricity comes from a lot of different sources. In 2022, 40 percent of it came from natural gas, about 20 percent from coal, and a little over 18 percent from nuclear.xv Now, there's an obvious question here: What about renewable sources like wind and solar?



That question is so obvious, in fact, that a lot of politicians are asking it too, which is why more than half of the states in the country are now required by law to get a certain percentage of their electricity from renewables.xvi In 10 of them, the requirement is that they eventually get 100 percent of their electricity from renewables.



And ... that doesn't sound bad, right? If it's all the same, why not use cleaner, more affordable power sources?



Well, here's the thing: It's not all the same. In fact, the way we're using renewables is making it more likely that we'll have more blackouts in our future.



One of the reasons that energy sources like wind and solar haven't traditionally provided much of our electricity is pretty basic: There are big stretches of time when they don't produce any energy at all.



So, how do we manage this problem?  So far, the answer has been to use renewable sources when they're available — and then conventional energy sources when they're not.



Wind stops blowing? Fire up the natural gas. Sun stops shining? Start burning some coal. Now, that means that all those renewable energy requirements aren't that realistic — but, hey, it also means your air conditioning stays on during a heat wave.



But here's where things get really tricky. As there's increasing pressure to move to renewable sources, many of those conventional power sources we rely on to make sure the lights stay on are shutting down. Which means that when renewables falter — whether in extreme weather or even just a series of cloudy days ... it's more likely that there won't be enough electricity to go around. And the implications are pretty sobering.



In 2022, the organization that monitors the grid's reliability warned that most of the country was going to be at an elevated risk of power outages in the next five years. The year prior, they cautioned that the risks associated with relying too heavily on renewables were "inconsistent with electric power's essentiality to the continent's economy as well as the health and safety of its population. And the language there is modest, but that's a lawyer's way of saying "we're %@$%#$."



What does this world of shortages look like? Well, ask the people in California, who, a week after their state voted to eventually move entirely to electric cars ... asked them not to charge their electric cars.xxii Or the people in New York, who've been told that their grid could fail if the temperature reaches 98 degrees. Or the owners of smart thermostats in Colorado ... who were locked out of being able to turn up their air conditioning during a heat wave.



hat's not most people's idea of progress. Whatever goals we have for the country's energy production, Americans have to have the power they need to do their jobs, cook their food, or power their medical devices.

[Adolf Oliver Bush]

Look, it's very simple; in terms of environmentally clean and reliable energy production, there is really only one answer; nuclear. It's not the only answer, you need fossil fueled supplies to take care of the shortfall. And you can please yourself if you put a renewable component in there as well, but understand that of all sources it is the least reliable and carries a fossil fuel component in it anyway, at the very least during the construction phase and longer if you expect to store the energy it produces in batteries.

[Shen Li]

Look, it's very simple; in terms of environmentally clean and reliable energy production, there is really only one answer; nuclear. It's not the only answer, you need fossil fueled supplies to take care of the shortfall. And you can please yourself if you put a renewable component in there as well, but understand that of all sources it is the least reliable and carries a fossil fuel component in it anyway, at the very least during the construction phase and longer if you expect to store the energy it produces in batteries.

For electricity, nuclear is among the best options.

[Oliver Clotheshoffe]

https://x-default-stgec.uplynk.com/ausw/slices/12f/5c3d34b8b29a45469a86c02775b7a2cf/12f2a2702ec046429544e8ab284bd6ac/poster_144ccbd3d0c1488e9abdafa0218fef30.jpg">https://x-default-stgec.uplynk.com/ausw ... 8fef30.jpg">https://x-default-stgec.uplynk.com/ausw/slices/12f/5c3d34b8b29a45469a86c02775b7a2cf/12f2a2702ec046429544e8ab284bd6ac/poster_144ccbd3d0c1488e9abdafa0218fef30.jpg[/img]



A row of electric semi-trucks caught fire early Friday morning in Phoenix.



The fire broke out at a Nikola facility near 40th Street and Broadway Road and dozens of firefighters were called out to fight the blaze.



Four trucks caught fire during the incident.



Phoenix Fire Department officials are asking the public to avoid the area due to the nature of the fire. There is a risk of the fires reigniting because they involve battery cells.



Officials say the trucks that caught fire were shut down and not operational at the time. It's not known what caused them to catch fire.



https://www.abc15.com/news/region-phoenix-metro/row-of-electric-semi-trucks-catches-fire-at-nikola-property-in-phoenix">https://www.abc15.com/news/region-phoen ... in-phoenix">https://www.abc15.com/news/region-phoenix-metro/row-of-electric-semi-trucks-catches-fire-at-nikola-property-in-phoenix

[DKG]

https://x-default-stgec.uplynk.com/ausw/slices/12f/5c3d34b8b29a45469a86c02775b7a2cf/12f2a2702ec046429544e8ab284bd6ac/poster_144ccbd3d0c1488e9abdafa0218fef30.jpg">https://x-default-stgec.uplynk.com/ausw ... 8fef30.jpg">https://x-default-stgec.uplynk.com/ausw/slices/12f/5c3d34b8b29a45469a86c02775b7a2cf/12f2a2702ec046429544e8ab284bd6ac/poster_144ccbd3d0c1488e9abdafa0218fef30.jpg[/img]



A row of electric semi-trucks caught fire early Friday morning in Phoenix.



The fire broke out at a Nikola facility near 40th Street and Broadway Road and dozens of firefighters were called out to fight the blaze.



Four trucks caught fire during the incident.



Phoenix Fire Department officials are asking the public to avoid the area due to the nature of the fire. There is a risk of the fires reigniting because they involve battery cells.



Officials say the trucks that caught fire were shut down and not operational at the time. It's not known what caused them to catch fire.



https://www.abc15.com/news/region-phoenix-metro/row-of-electric-semi-trucks-catches-fire-at-nikola-property-in-phoenix">https://www.abc15.com/news/region-phoen ... in-phoenix">https://www.abc15.com/news/region-phoenix-metro/row-of-electric-semi-trucks-catches-fire-at-nikola-property-in-phoenix

It must have been a lot of work extinguishing those fires.

[Oerdin]

It doesn't look like electric semi trucks make financial sense.  Which is what most experts expected.  Basically, it costs twice as much as a standard diesel model, has less range, spends more time down due to charging, and 3ven the cheaper fuel costs are not that much due to the high cost of electricity in California where the tests were conducted.  California has extremely high electricity costs due to over regulation and state mandates for extremely expensive so called "green energy".



https://www.torquenews.com/1/pepsi-reveal-tesla-semi-operations-details-real-mileage-numbers/amp">https://www.torquenews.com/1/pepsi-reve ... umbers/amp">https://www.torquenews.com/1/pepsi-reveal-tesla-semi-operations-details-real-mileage-numbers/amp

[DKG]

It doesn't look like electric semi trucks make financial sense.  Which is what most experts expected.  Basically, it costs twice as much as a standard diesel model, has less range, spends more time down due to charging, and 3ven the cheaper fuel costs are not that much due to the high cost of electricity in California where the tests were conducted.  California has extremely high electricity costs due to over regulation and state mandates for extremely expensive so called "green energy".



https://www.torquenews.com/1/pepsi-reveal-tesla-semi-operations-details-real-mileage-numbers/amp">https://www.torquenews.com/1/pepsi-reve ... umbers/amp">https://www.torquenews.com/1/pepsi-reveal-tesla-semi-operations-details-real-mileage-numbers/amp

I would imagine the heavier the load, the more it drains the battery too.

[Oerdin]

Exactly.  EVe are just garbage at towing.  Which is why no one who tows anything is going to want an electric truck.  It is even worse because if it gets cold batteries lose much of their range and if it gets to hot batteries catch fire and explode.  This is a half baked idea not ready for prime time.

[DKG]

Exactly.  EVe are just garbage at towing.  Which is why no one who tows anything is going to want an electric truck.

That is what I figured. I cannot imagine electric excavators, cranes, front end loaders, and any other heavy equipment ever being electric.

[Oerdin]

I was watching the Joe Rogan interview with RFK the other day and while he is a lefty he is at least not an establishment lefty and so he isn't afraid to gore some of their politically sacred cows.  That is refreshing.  That said, the guy still said some deliberately left wing lies about "green energy".  



He claimed it was 20% cheaper than coal or natural gas to build solar and 15% cheaper to build wind.  He is lying and he knows it.  Yes, the projected "total life time costs" might be marginally lower but here is the problem.  With a fossil fuel fired power plant only 20% of the total lifetime cost has to be paid up front, that is the construction cost, while the other 80% is fuel costs which is pay as you go paid out over a 30-50byear life span of the plant.  80%-90% of wind or solar has to be paid up front (construction costs) while the rest is maintenance over the 20-30;year expected life span.  Yes, green lasts a hell of a lot less time (20 years vs 50 years).



Now, consider the financing costs.  A coal plant might be $1.8 billion vs $1.5 billion total life time cost for solar but the company only has to finance   $360 million upfront and the rest is fuel paid over a year period.   With solar $1.2 billion has to be financed upfront with the rest paid over just a 30 year period.  That is a fuck ton more money up front before we even start talking about interest rates and financing charges.  No, green isn't cheaper and lefties are lying to you.

[Oerdin]

Now consider that solar really only works in the sun belt not in places with little sun, lots of clouds, or where the panels will be covered with snow for a quarter of the year.  Wind only works where it is very windy.  So you can't really build solar in Buffalo.  Wind and solar is, at best, only part of the solution and we will still need reliable and safe base load power.   Nuclear and hydro are the answer but lefties hate those too.

[DKG]

I was watching the Joe Rogan interview with RFK the other day and while he is a lefty he is at least not an establishment lefty and so he isn't afraid to gore some of their politically sacred cows.  That is refreshing.  That said, the guy still said some deliberately left wing lies about "green energy".  



He claimed it was 20% cheaper than coal or natural gas to build solar and 15% cheaper to build wind.  He is lying and he knows it.  Yes, the projected "total life time costs" might be marginally lower but here is the problem.  With a fossil fuel fired power plant only 20% of the total lifetime cost has to be paid up front, that is the construction cost, while the other 80% is fuel costs which is pay as you go paid out over a 30-50byear life span of the plant.  80%-90% of wind or solar has to be paid up front (construction costs) while the rest is maintenance over the 20-30;year expected life span.  Yes, green lasts a hell of a lot less time (20 years vs 50 years).



Now, consider the financing costs.  A coal plant might be $1.8 billion vs $1.5 billion total life time cost for solar but the company only has to finance   $360 million upfront and the rest is fuel paid over a year period.   With solar $1.2 billion has to be financed upfront with the rest paid over just a 30 year period.  That is a fuck ton more money up front before we even start talking about interest rates and financing charges.  No, green isn't cheaper and lefties are lying to you.

That likely doesn't take into account the expensive transmission infrastructure required for wind and solar either.