Self defense or not self defense?

[Biggie Smiles]

Read the article and post your opinion here

https://www.foxnews.com/us/father-son-farmers-charged-killing-armed-trespasser


Unless additional details which are contrary to what is available now emerge, I am on the side of law enforcement on this one. This was NOT self defense as the perpetrator had already been disarmed and therefore the threat neutralized

I understand the dude was trespassing and I get the fact that he came armed and looking for trouble, and had they fired the rounds while he was still armed with, and swinging the machete, they'd be in the clear. But that's not what happened apparently.

According to their own statements the father had already disarmed the man and THEN proceeded to instruct his son to shoot the guy. That's homicide my friend. In fact, that's an execution.

If I were on the jury it would be a solid guilty as charged verdict from me and I am an ardent supporter of 2nd amendment rights and own several weapons myself.

[deadskinmask]

if we lived in a country where the rule of law was upheld equally and without prejudice, i would agree with you.... but as we sink further into lawlessness where "racial equity" and "social justice" create policies like "no cash bail" and "reduced sentencing", allowing a known threat to survive only gives them the opportunity to become a larger threat....

[DKG]

if we lived in a country where the rule of law was upheld equally and without prejudice, i would agree with you.... but as we sink further into lawlessness where "racial equity" and "social justice" create policies like "no cash bail" and "reduced sentencing", allowing a known threat to survive only gives them the opportunity to become a larger threat....

They are separate issues. The question here is whether this was self defense or not. I agree with Biggie, this was an execution.

[Biggie Smiles]

I get DSM's position but at the same time you cannot have a society where one is allowed to kill another based on the mere suspicion that person might return to do additional harm at some future point

that's going to open pandoras box.

The law makes provisions for one to use deadly force in the event their lives are in immediate real danger. Once this man had been disarmed he was no longer a life threatening danger to a pair of grown men that BOTH outweighed him by at least 50 pounds and had a handgun in their possession.

I'm pretty sure that had the son pulled out that glock and merely pointed it at the guy the threat level would have nose dived even further.

this was an execution style murder

[Lokmar]

Read the article and post your opinion here

https://www.foxnews.com/us/father-son-farmers-charged-killing-armed-trespasser


Unless additional details which are contrary to what is available now emerge, I am on the side of law enforcement on this one. This was NOT self defense as the perpetrator had already been disarmed and therefore the threat neutralized

I understand the dude was trespassing and I get the fact that he came armed and looking for trouble, and had they fired the rounds while he was still armed with, and swinging the machete, they'd be in the clear. But that's not what happened apparently.

According to their own statements the father had already disarmed the man and THEN proceeded to instruct his son to shoot the guy. That's homicide my friend. In fact, that's an execution.

If I were on the jury it would be a solid guilty as charged verdict from me and I am an ardent supporter of 2nd amendment rights and own several weapons myself.

Here's my problem with this article:

"The sheriff said over the weekend that the elder Lindler disarmed Newhouse before telling his son to shoot him."
"Over the course of their investigation, which included interviews with both Lindlers and witnesses, detectives determined the elder Lindler told his son to shoot the victim,"
vs
"The younger Lindler told police Newhouse swung the machete at him and his father, striking each of them during the altercation, according to an incident report from the sheriff's office."

"That's when Lindler Jr. is accused of firing three to four rounds from a Glock handgun. At least one shot fatally struck Newhouse in the head, according to the incident report."

There's missing detail. The detectives determined? I suspect there may have been some ambiguity in statements or something so the cops basically kicked it to the DA. I cant make a call due to the conflicting statements. Hopefully they get a fair trial and justice is served.

[Biggie Smiles]

Good observation.

and yeah, if the dude was still in the midst of swinging that machete when the shots were fired then that swings things in the opposite direction.

[Oliver the Second]

WTF Fox wants me to make an account before it lets me read the article? They can go Fox themselves!

[deadskinmask]

They are separate issues. The question here is whether this was self defense or not. I agree with Biggie, this was an execution.

when the criminal (which has already shown a disdain for the law and also shown he definitely intends to do you harm) can potentially be arrested, booked and released in a hour without even posting money.... and further still could avoid prosecution for any number of reasons.... and be right back at your house with guns instead of a machete.... yes, man.... i believe that can be classified as "self-defense".... despite the preemptive nature....

[Adolf Oliver Bush]

WTF Fox wants me to make an account before it lets me read the article? They can go Fox themselves!

Yeah, I keep telling these nongs they need to supply archived links to get around paywalls and avoid paying for clickbait.

It's actually quite easy to do. Observe...


https://www.foxnews.com/us/father-son-farmers-charged-killing-armed-trespasser


+


https://www.archive.today


=


https://archive.ph/Ki42O (aka - the snapshot of the original link, minus paywalls, subsequent ninja edits and any other assorted forms of media shitbaggery)


Cretins could do it.

[DKG]

when the criminal (which has already shown a disdain for the law and also shown he definitely intends to do you harm) can potentially be arrested, booked and released in a hour without even posting money.... and further still could avoid prosecution for any number of reasons.... and be right back at your house with guns instead of a machete.... yes, man.... i believe that can be classified as "self-defense".... despite the preemptive nature....

For some reason, I am not always able to see videos. My answer is based on what I read and not on the Fox video.

[deadskinmask]

For some reason, I am not always able to see videos. My answer is based on what I read and not on the Fox video.

my answer is based on the headline (armed intruder + private property) and my increasing lack of confidence in our current legal system via liberal control.... the article and the video weren't even calculated into the equation for me.... 

[Dove]

when the criminal (which has already shown a disdain for the law and also shown he definitely intends to do you harm) can potentially be arrested, booked and released in a hour without even posting money.... and further still could avoid prosecution for any number of reasons.... and be right back at your house with guns instead of a machete.... yes, man.... i believe that can be classified as "self-defense".... despite the preemptive nature....

 Yeah that could happen. And if it does then you kill them.

 But this isn't self defense what happened here. Your arguments are more in line if the question was "is this justified murder", not "is this self defense".

 Because it's not self defense by any definition lol.

 I'm not sad about it...but I don't condone it.

[deadskinmask]

Yeah that could happen. And if it does then you kill them.

 But this isn't self defense what happened here. Your arguments are more in line if the question was "is this justified murder", not "is this self defense".

 Because it's not self defense by any definition lol.

 I'm not sad about it...but I don't condone it.

you know what.... i think i may have lived in the swamp too long.... my family jokes that i'm not fit for "civilized society" but i'm starting to suspect they're correct.... and i think you might be correct as well.... certainly a justified killing.... but not self-defense....