Panama papers: China censors online discussion

[Anonymous]

I have NEVER in my life paid a dime when eating or dining with a millionaire.

Neither do the first four people who have been drinking off the rich guy.

Have you ever talked to a "rich" person about paying taxes?

I am the consultant. I deal with wealthy contractors every single day I am on the lease. I was part owner in a swabbing outfit in the early 2000's.  ELPHUPPHY's characterization of wealthy people is so ignorant and wrong I do not even know where to begin.

Tsk tsk, there Herrmie. While you may not agree with me, it's rather harsh to characterize my comments as ignorant. Shame on you. I thought this board was a bit more polite than that.

Herman is a nice guy and has had an interesting work career..



He's a little rough around the edges..



But what you wrote about rich people is the no different than saying poor people are all lazy, drug and alcohol addicted.

[RW]

So...



What do you want to bet that a good number of the Canadians who have money in these accounts haven't declared it to CRA as income?

[RW]

Shen is a bad influence on him Haha



Now what did Phuppy write that was stereotypical?  I missed it.  I did see him say he thinks the wealthy people he's been around paid his tab because they felt sorry for him and his lack of income.  How that's comparable to calling poor people lazy, I'm not sure.

[ELPHUPPHY]

I have NEVER in my life paid a dime when eating or dining with a millionaire.

Neither do the first four people who have been drinking off the rich guy.

Have you ever talked to a "rich" person about paying taxes?

I am the consultant. I deal with wealthy contractors every single day I am on the lease. I was part owner in a swabbing outfit in the early 2000's.  ELPHUPPHY's characterization of wealthy people is so ignorant and wrong I do not even know where to begin.

Tsk tsk, there Herrmie. While you may not agree with me, it's rather harsh to characterize my comments as ignorant. Shame on you. I thought this board was a bit more polite than that.

Herman is a nice guy and has had an interesting work career..



He's a little rough around the edges..



But what you wrote about rich people is the no different than saying poor people are all lazy, drug and alcohol addicted.

I didn't think so at all. It certainly wasnt meant that way. I said, I think, that the few rich people I know tend to pick up tabs because they might have felt sorry for me because I earn less then they do. I make, by the way, a touch under $60,000, so I'm not indigent. I think picking up the tab is something rich folks do as a friendly kind of thing, not as something meant to demean us lowlies. To say my comment was ignorant would, on another board, be grounds for a war. There's no reason to insult me because my statement is not agreed with. I'll over look it because I'm not here to fight with anyone.

[Anonymous]

Two threads about the same thing..



I noticed someone had posted a link to a Nick Hanauer speech..



Not that long ago, I read an article about him..



He promotes raising the American minimum wage nationally to $15 an hour, but pays his own workers less than half that..



Nothing against Peaches, but I am tired of rich hypocrites like him who are politically connected, preach one thing and do the opposite..



It is as hypocritical as Leonardo DiCaprio calling us greedy for using fossil fuels to make our lives better while he rents gigantic yachts, has several homes and uses private aircraft all the time.

 

You are spot on as usual Fash. Hanauer's illogical rants and buying of leftist politicians is the problem not the solution. In fact that plutocrat speech was so so full of holes TED refused to carry it. It was to economics what Al Gore's Inconvenient Truth was to climate change---pure fiction.



We had an election in this country where the current pm promised more goodies for almost everyone and it would be paid in full by the "rich." We know how that worked out and who will really be paying for it----your kids.  Like you said, Hanauer is a hypocrite who does not walk the talk. If he was serious about growing the middle class(much more important than so called income equality) he would take the cash that he is just sitting on and innovate his businesses to make each worker more productive allowing for higher wages. It would also create new jobs too. He has the power and resources right now without buying politicians to change things for the economy and the people. The fact that he does not proves his speech does not water.

[ELPHUPPHY]

So...



What do you want to bet that a good number of the Canadians who have money in these accounts haven't declared it to CRA as income?

That seems to be a safe bet. After all, the average Joe has no need nor use for an offshore account. They haven't got resources to hide from the gummint.

[Anonymous]

When read about the very rich who tell us that increased taxes on their income or carbon pricing will make our lives better I know the opposite is true..



Taiwan can no longer grow at the high rates that it has in the past..



Super rich industrialists with ties to the Kuomintang said tax the rich to make up for stagnant economic growth and wages and that money would be reinvested into people and the economy..



The result was less revenue for Taipei as the affluent produced less or worse moved their small factories to South East Asia but subsidies for the super rich who benefitted from green projects and infrastructure contracts..



It would be preferable for Americans if Mr Hanauer or Buffett gave their billions to scholarships, dental and pharma care, medical research, The Salvation Army, invest in new or existing businesses and pay better wages than pay more In taxes.

[Anonymous]

Peaches, that article was not well worth the read? It did not come close to getting at the state of the US economy today. Take a look at this link for an accurate account of what is actually happening in the market place today and why.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-07-02/other-side-hanauer-plutocrat-poverty">http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-07-0 ... at-poverty">http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-07-02/other-side-hanauer-plutocrat-poverty

I'll read your article when I have time.  However, the article I linked was not intended to be about the state of the US economy today.  I am not even persuaded that the state of the US economy even matters a lot to the plutocrats to whom the article is addressed.  



I'll also add, re the rest of that post, that one reason income tax rates are progressive is because all other taxes to which we are subject...tend to be REgressive.  It's been argued that even a flat tax will not correct the overall regressive nature of taxes.

That article I linked tears to shreds Hanauer's entire eat the rich plutocrat case. It exposes it as nothing more than the empty slogan and distraction that it is.  



So you do acknowledge that the upper income earners in the US pay the majority of income taxes? But, it's a misnomer to claim that flat taxes are regressive. I would argue that progressive taxation without limitation is the most regressive form of taxation a nation can inflict upon itself.

Yes, of course I do acknowledge that the majority of US income taxes are paid by those in higher brackets...but I'm unsure what your point is.  As to the part I bolded in your post, I'd be interested in hearing that argument ...especially since the claim doesn't compute at all for me.

[RW]

Trickle down economics is fail Fash.  Well established.

[Anonymous]

Trickle down economics is fail Fash.  Well established.

Is Canada a failure..



Is that well established?

[RW]

Do we follow a trickle down economic model?

[Anonymous]

Trickle down economics is fail Fash.  Well established.

Is Canada a failure..



Is that well established?

Rewarding producers is what successful economies have done Fash. Some form of supply side economics such as tax breaks and dereulation are some of the tools used from Stockholm to Singapore. That is well established. It's how our countries lifted themselves out of poverty



But, Taiwan and Korea as well as Canada have all reached growth limits for a number of reasons. Trudeau is not going to restore pent up consumer demand of the sixties with his fantasy Robin Hood promises. His own numbers show that.

[Anonymous]

Trickle down economics is fail Fash.  Well established.

Is Canada a failure..



Is that well established?

Rewarding producers is what successful economies have done Fash. Some form of supply side economics such as tax breaks and dereulation are some of the tools used from Stockholm to Singapore. That is well established. It's how our countries lifted themselves out of poverty



But, Taiwan and Korea as well as Canada have all reached growth limits for a number of reasons. Trudeau is not going to restore pent up consumer demand of the sixties with his fantasy Robin Hood promises. His own numbers show that.

We can see in this country how increased regulation and bureaucratic red tape have worked. We can't get a single frickin new pipeline to tidewater built. If we had a government like Sweden or Singapore we would have a major industrial project like EE not only approved, but in the ground producing revenue and jobs.

[Anonymous]

The result was less revenue for Taipei as the affluent produced less or worse moved their small factories to South East Asia but subsidies for the super rich who benefitted from green projects and infrastructure contracts..



It would be preferable for Americans if Mr Hanauer or Buffett gave their billions to scholarships, dental and pharma care, medical research, The Salvation Army, invest in new or existing businesses and pay better wages than pay more In taxes.

It's not just Taiwan, that's everywhere. Higher taxes are usually combined with more spending and produce less revenue and future tax increases for everyone to cover the increased debt. My kid brother lives in Portugal. Right next door in Spain sky high taxes have driven a sick economy's best and brightest along with their capital to other countries in Europe furthering that country's decline. Hell, it's happening in parts of Canada too.



A buddy of mine is the sole proprietor of a sucker truck and water hauling business in Brooks. He is using both types of trucks for mostly none oilfield related work right now. He said he will not pay the combined federal and provincial 20% increase in taxes so Trudeau can buy off corrupt Indian chiefs and Notley can buy the approval of provincial labor union bosses. He will deliberately work less this year. The result is  less work for contracted drivers and less revenue for Alberta and Canada. This comes back to the op point of how government greed has a negative impact on the everyone, poor, middle and rich.

[Anonymous]

The personal income tax, a dominant source of revenue among Western countries, is of relatively minor importance in Korea.  Taxes on consumption are by far the dominant source of revenue, although their share has been on a declining trend.  More than half of consumption tax revenues come from the VAT with the rest contributed by a variety of excise taxes. Korea's economic decline has coincided with more reliance on corporate and income taxes vs the traditional consumption and excise taxes.