Re: Western Left Should Focus On Poverty Rather Than Inequal

[Anonymous]

I wonder how long it will take for that idiot EU to quote from his class warfare stupidity for dummies book?

[Romero]

Poverty and inequality go hand in hand. Wages are stagnant for the lower and middle class and only the already wealthy are seeing any gains. It's not supposed to be like this.



Well, the last several years definitively proves that inequality and 'trickle-down' doesn't work. Capitalist consumer economies need lower and middle class cash and they're not buying. Too busy being nickel-and-dimed. The more gains the wealthy get, the more they simply hoard it and beg for more.

Sweden is a good example, as are most of the Scandinavian countries.

Damn good example. Social democracy, social spending, low inequality, low poverty, lots of good capitalism...



Canada's doing fairly well because our ideology is somewhat similar to Scandinavian countries. The US needs a lot more of it. Again, the last several years is definitive proof.

[cc]

WTF is this "Sweden is a good example .... low inequality, low poverty" stuff? That line went up in flames .. literally ... The real truth is out now.



Good thread SL.

[Odinson]

Does the communist even know that Sweden has a royal family?

Yup, I think I will be treated just as good as them.  

[Odinson]

Does the communist even know that Sweden has a royal family?

Yup, I think I will be treated just as good as them.  

Too many fuckin Chinks will sink any society. ;)

 

[Odinson]

Poverty and inequality go hand in hand. Wages are stagnant for the lower and middle class and only the already wealthy are seeing any gains. It's not supposed to be like this.

If you have in-demand skills you are doing very well. If you have a useless Bachelor of Farts degree you made your choices in life.

Well, the last several years definitively proves that inequality and 'trickle-down' doesn't work. Capitalist consumer economies need lower and middle class cash and they're not buying. Too busy being nickel-and-dimed. The more gains the wealthy get, the more they simply hoard it and beg for more.

The West peaked about 4 decades ago. The last few years are an example of how entitlements are unsustainable. Westerners are not living within their means and are not saving. Hard to feel sorry for people like that when they end up broke.

Sweden is a good example, as are most of the Scandinavian countries.

Damn good example. Social democracy, social spending, low inequality, low poverty, lots of good capitalism...

Yes, if you are white. If you are a woman of colour like me it means discrimination, unemployment and poverty. As visible minority I would never live in those bigoted Nordic shitholes. Well, I would live at Odie's place. ;)

Canada's doing fairly well because our ideology is somewhat similar to Scandinavian countries. The US needs a lot more of it. Again, the last several years is definitive proof.

Australia/Canada do well because we reject the foolish immigration examples of Nordic countries and seek the successful. More importantly we have resources the emerging economies need.

I will escort you through these evil bigots and you can hide in my closet until everything is safe.  ;)

[Odinson]

If you have in-demand skills you are doing very well. If you have a useless Bachelor of Farts degree you made your choices in life.





The West peaked about 4 decades ago. The last few years are an example of how entitlements are unsustainable. Westerners are not living within their means and are not saving. Hard to feel sorry for people like that when they end up broke.





Yes, if you are white. If you are a woman of colour like me it means discrimination, unemployment and poverty. As visible minority I would never live in those bigoted Nordic shitholes. Well, I would live at Odie's place. ;)





Australia/Canada do well because we reject the foolish immigration examples of Nordic countries and seek the successful. More importantly we have resources the emerging economies need.

I will escort you through these evil bigots and you can hide in my closet until everything is safe.  ;)

I will take you up on your offer.

 :D

[Anonymous]

I conflate poverty and inequality.

[Romero]

Even as the economy slowly recovers from the worst downturn since the Great Depression, government-haters and deficit-hawks are sticking to their same story: Americans have lived beyond their means and must now learn to live within them.



The reality is quite different: The means of most Americans haven't kept up with what the economy could and should provide. The economy is twice as large as it was three decades ago, and yet the typical American is earning about the same, adjusted for inflation. All the gains have been going to the top.



The notion that we can't afford to invest in the education of our young, or rebuild our crumbling infrastructure, or continue to provide Social Security and Medicare and Medicaid, or expand health insurance is absurd.



If the median wage had kept up with the overall economy, it would be over $90,000 today — and tax revenues would be more than adequate to cover all our needs. If the wealthy were paying the same marginal tax rate they were paying up to 1981, tax revenues would be far more.



Get it? The problem isn't that most Americans have been living too well. The problem is we haven't been living nearly as well as our growing economy should have allowed us to live.



Widening inequality is the culprit.



http://www.commondreams.org/video/2013/05/31-0">//http://www.commondreams.org/video/2013/05/31-0

[Romero]

American productivity hasn't peaked over four decades. Other than stalling during the Great Recession, it's been going up year after year.



http://thebreakthrough.org/images/main_image/productivity_and_employment_in_the_US_1947-2012.png">



It's wages that have peaked four decades ago.



http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/ezra-klein/files/2012/08/compensation_productivity.jpg">

[Romero]

No prob. Well, it's no surprise that the economy peaked when wages leveled off. Can't stay out of debt if you're not making any money.



What happened? We did exactly what they wanted. Lower wages, lower union membership, outsourcing, mergers, free trade, less regulation, higher profits and more austerity... and this is what we get?



I certainly wouldn't mind things going back to where they were in the good ol' days.

[Anonymous]

My apaologies, I meant to say the American economy peaked over 4 decades ago and for the reasons cited by Andrew Coyne. People have tried to make up the difference in economic growth with debt. Of course that is suicidal.

Data from the Bureau of Labor Statistics shows that

Several of my girlfriends are digging themselves into a hole that way..



They have better careers than I do, only one child, but have a lifestyle that does not match their income..



For them it is always someone else's fault they cannot budget..



When I suggest they track where their money is going they suddenly get defensive..



How can anyone get out of debt and start living within their means when they do not want to even know where their earnings are going?

[Romero]

The economy is growing. Other than stalling during the Great Recession, GDP in Canada and the US has been rising. Rising pretty decently since the 1970's.