Poll: 40% of Americans blame both sides for Charlottesville Violence

[Anonymous]

Masked,  violent,intolerant anarchists have journalists in their crosshairs  now



The fascism of the 'anti-fascists' on display

To some fevered minds in the punditocracy the, ahem, "anti-fascist" demonstrators in Quebec City last weekend were like our Allied forces storming the beaches of Normandy to take on Hitler.



Odd, but I don't recall our World War II vets, having defeated Nazism, returning home to attack police with smoke bombs, fireworks and glass bottles.



Nor do I recall them assaulting journalists.



But that's what happened to a Global TV news crew last Sunday afternoon in Quebec City, there to cover the dueling protests between a far-right, anti-immigration group called La Meute ("The Pack") and, ahem, "anti-fascist" counter protesters.



As Global made clear in its story headlined, "Quebec City protests: anti-fascist protesters clash with police" -- the violence came from one side only, the so-called "anti-fascists".



At 2:15 pm, Global reporter Dan Spector tweeted, "Quebec police have just declared the protest illegal. Antifa (anti-fascists) are shooting fireworks and smoke bombs."



At 3:40 pm, Spector tweeted: "Protestors wearing black with their faces covered smashed (Global cameraman Jean-Vincent Verveille's) camera."



At 5:28 pm, Global reporter Mike Armstrong, shoved down some stairs by the "anti-fascists", tweeted: "Great shots in our story tonight by colleague JV (Jean-Vincent Verveille). He took some great stuff until his cam was spiked like a football by masked protestors."



At 5:48 pm., Armstrong tweeted: "On the masked figures that assaulted us today ... It was a violent faction of anti-racists. La Meute hasn't even come out of the garage (where it initially gathered) yet."



Following these unprovoked assaults on its news crew by the, ahem, "anti-fascists", Global News Senior VP Troy Reeb issued the following statement:



"We are disgusted and outraged by today's unprovoked attack on a Global News crew covering demonstrations in Quebec City. While we are relieved that our journalists were not seriously hurt, Canadians should be concerned by this threat against the working of a free press. Our team was there to provide independent coverage and transparency as events unfolded – a goal clearly not shared by the thugs who shielded their identities in the commission of violence."



One would have hoped more media pundits, who think about stuff a lot as opposed to covering the news like working journalists, would have joined Reeb in expressing solidarity with Global's news crew and in condemning the so-called "anti-fascist" demonstrators who attacked them.



Alas, many were too busy writing painfully stupid columns arguing the anti-fascist protesters are defending democracy, while the fascist protesters want to establish a racist, totalitarian state.



In the real world, the fascist protesters are human scum, but the anti-fascists who violently engage them are no better.



Many of these "anti-fascists" are anarchists, others have no idea what they want, and all would, I guarantee you, be as bad as the fascists if they ever controlled the levers of power.



By contrast, our World War II vets fought and died to defend democracy and defeat totalitarianism.



They believed in the rule of law and that governments derive their just powers from the consent of the governed.



They defeated tyranny and returned home, where their loved ones had sacrificed along with them, to build a better life for their children. They were our greatest generation.



To compare them to these so-called "anti-fascist" thugs on the streets not just of Quebec, but everywhere, is to insult their honour and their memory.

http://www.edmontonsun.com/2017/08/23/the-fascism-of-the-anti-fascists-on-display">http://www.edmontonsun.com/2017/08/23/t ... on-display">http://www.edmontonsun.com/2017/08/23/the-fascism-of-the-anti-fascists-on-display

[RW]

Masked,  violent,intolerant anarchists have journalists in their crosshairs  now



The fascism of the 'anti-fascists' on display

To some fevered minds in the punditocracy the, ahem, "anti-fascist" demonstrators in Quebec City last weekend were like our Allied forces storming the beaches of Normandy to take on Hitler.



Odd, but I don't recall our World War II vets, having defeated Nazism, returning home to attack police with smoke bombs, fireworks and glass bottles.



Nor do I recall them assaulting journalists.



But that's what happened to a Global TV news crew last Sunday afternoon in Quebec City, there to cover the dueling protests between a far-right, anti-immigration group called La Meute ("The Pack") and, ahem, "anti-fascist" counter protesters.



As Global made clear in its story headlined, "Quebec City protests: anti-fascist protesters clash with police" -- the violence came from one side only, the so-called "anti-fascists".



At 2:15 pm, Global reporter Dan Spector tweeted, "Quebec police have just declared the protest illegal. Antifa (anti-fascists) are shooting fireworks and smoke bombs."



At 3:40 pm, Spector tweeted: "Protestors wearing black with their faces covered smashed (Global cameraman Jean-Vincent Verveille's) camera."



At 5:28 pm, Global reporter Mike Armstrong, shoved down some stairs by the "anti-fascists", tweeted: "Great shots in our story tonight by colleague JV (Jean-Vincent Verveille). He took some great stuff until his cam was spiked like a football by masked protestors."



At 5:48 pm., Armstrong tweeted: "On the masked figures that assaulted us today ... It was a violent faction of anti-racists. La Meute hasn't even come out of the garage (where it initially gathered) yet."



Following these unprovoked assaults on its news crew by the, ahem, "anti-fascists", Global News Senior VP Troy Reeb issued the following statement:



"We are disgusted and outraged by today's unprovoked attack on a Global News crew covering demonstrations in Quebec City. While we are relieved that our journalists were not seriously hurt, Canadians should be concerned by this threat against the working of a free press. Our team was there to provide independent coverage and transparency as events unfolded – a goal clearly not shared by the thugs who shielded their identities in the commission of violence."



One would have hoped more media pundits, who think about stuff a lot as opposed to covering the news like working journalists, would have joined Reeb in expressing solidarity with Global's news crew and in condemning the so-called "anti-fascist" demonstrators who attacked them.



Alas, many were too busy writing painfully stupid columns arguing the anti-fascist protesters are defending democracy, while the fascist protesters want to establish a racist, totalitarian state.



In the real world, the fascist protesters are human scum, but the anti-fascists who violently engage them are no better.



Many of these "anti-fascists" are anarchists, others have no idea what they want, and all would, I guarantee you, be as bad as the fascists if they ever controlled the levers of power.



By contrast, our World War II vets fought and died to defend democracy and defeat totalitarianism.



They believed in the rule of law and that governments derive their just powers from the consent of the governed.



They defeated tyranny and returned home, where their loved ones had sacrificed along with them, to build a better life for their children. They were our greatest generation.



To compare them to these so-called "anti-fascist" thugs on the streets not just of Quebec, but everywhere, is to insult their honour and their memory.

http://www.edmontonsun.com/2017/08/23/the-fascism-of-the-anti-fascists-on-display">http://www.edmontonsun.com/2017/08/23/t ... on-display">http://www.edmontonsun.com/2017/08/23/the-fascism-of-the-anti-fascists-on-display

I have yet to see someone on this board support AntiFa.



Now where's the outrage at the blatant and vile bigotry and racism purported by the alt-right?  Someone DIED in Virginia at the hands of a neo nazi.

[Anonymous]

RW, yank your head out of your ass.



Besides  Scouser, nobody here agrees with the alt right. However, as fucked as their opinions are they do not cause the violence, disruption and burden on emergency services that those cowardly, masked antifa POS thugs do. Let's be honest for a change,they are urban terrorists that we tacitly tolerate.  It's this tolerance for intolerance by the Charlottesville police that caused a death. Not that antifa gives a shit. Collateral damage as far as those animals are concerned.

[Blazor]

Hate speech is defined legally here as any speech calling for violence or genocide against a person or group based on race, religion, creed, gender, sexuality, etc.



But yes, I HATE racism. Don't you?



That said, being a racist isn't illegal nor should it be as long as violence isn't being advocated against a group.



I'm really surprised by the response to blatant and disgusting racist rhetoric against blacks, Jews, etc, given how many of you are not white.  I understand not supporting violence but why does it seem like I am the only one who is denouncing the message of neo nazis?



Very strange.

No one likes racism RW. Have you ever thought some of these "racists" were either raised that way, something terrible happened to them that made them that way, it is their belief, or maybe its a mental issue. A number of possibilities. As long as there is no violence, and they have the freedom of speech, they deserve to speak, and have that right. These folks were not allowed to speak, and violence was brought to their door, not the other way around. Had Antifa not showed up armed with projectiles of filth and pain, aiming hate at people who there rightfully to speak, this would have never escalated the way it did.



It seems you are the only one that doesnt see the other side, and are blinded by the media's portrayal of "racism" from these folks. Not all of them were racists.



I like you RW, but I dont like that you cant see, and want to throw the "racists" under the bus the same way the media is doing. "Time to put your glasses on" comes to mind  ac_cool



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https://media.giphy.com/media/uA3HaPHTCyHQc/giphy.gif">





 

Throw racists under the bus?  They should be thrown under buses!  In fact, we had an incident here in Vancouver on the skytrain where a woman went off on an Asian couple.  She got put in her place quickly.  That's how it should be.



You guys talk about the violence of AntiFa and I've denounced it. You talk about freedom of speech, and I've supported it within the law.  But Blazor, it wasn't AntiFa that took away a woman's freedom of speech FOREVER.  Are you intentionally ignoring that fact?

You missed my point that these people have different beliefs. Just like Christianity vs Islam vs Buddhism, etc. Those people still have rights. If someone decides to be racist, shame on them, and thats good that one skytrain woman got put in her place, but they still have their own beliefs and rights. Or perhaps it was one of the other things that I mentioned, a mental disorder, like the guy that ran over that woman. I dont think mentally disturbed people should be thrown under buses, instead should receive proper treatment. (maybe this guy though should get a harsh punishment)



Oh I know it wasnt Antifa, but if not for Antifa she would still be alive. Im not intentionally ignoring that fact, that was the worst thing of that day. But it was an individual from Ohio that was mentally disturbed with a history of it. It wasnt "the racists", one man only.

[cc]

You are not talking to a listener ... or you would not be still having to say it



As for "denouncing the message of neo nazis?" she needs told that she does not hold the patent on that.

OK. I'll do it. "You do  not hold the patent on that"



In a real world with real people, said once covers it ... Saying something "more often" than others does a saint make



Anyhow, as you made clear Blaze, Nazis are of little effect in the overall and certainly are not the coming / rapidly growing  serious problem for society.



 You have also made clear that Antifa .. Fascits Inc. appears to be rapidly growing into a serious and too real problem .. grabbing onto ANY convenient "cause du jour" (while not necessarily caring a wit about it)    to grow and show their rapidly increasing power, rapidly increasing intimidation via threat of violence and rapidly  increasing actual violence



The page has turned!!!

[RW]

RW, yank your head out of your ass.



Besides  Scouser, nobody here agrees with the alt right. However, as fucked as their opinions are they do not cause the violence, disruption and burden on emergency services that those cowardly, masked antifa POS thugs do. Let's be honest for a change,they are urban terrorists that we tacitly tolerate.  It's this tolerance for intolerance by the Charlottesville police that caused a death. Not that antifa gives a shit. Collateral damage as far as those animals are concerned.

[RW]

Hate speech is defined legally here as any speech calling for violence or genocide against a person or group based on race, religion, creed, gender, sexuality, etc.



But yes, I HATE racism. Don't you?



That said, being a racist isn't illegal nor should it be as long as violence isn't being advocated against a group.



I'm really surprised by the response to blatant and disgusting racist rhetoric against blacks, Jews, etc, given how many of you are not white.  I understand not supporting violence but why does it seem like I am the only one who is denouncing the message of neo nazis?



Very strange.

No one likes racism RW. Have you ever thought some of these "racists" were either raised that way, something terrible happened to them that made them that way, it is their belief, or maybe its a mental issue. A number of possibilities. As long as there is no violence, and they have the freedom of speech, they deserve to speak, and have that right. These folks were not allowed to speak, and violence was brought to their door, not the other way around. Had Antifa not showed up armed with projectiles of filth and pain, aiming hate at people who there rightfully to speak, this would have never escalated the way it did.



It seems you are the only one that doesnt see the other side, and are blinded by the media's portrayal of "racism" from these folks. Not all of them were racists.



I like you RW, but I dont like that you cant see, and want to throw the "racists" under the bus the same way the media is doing. "Time to put your glasses on" comes to mind  ac_cool



https://i.makeagif.com/media/9-17-2015/Q94UC3.gif">



https://media.giphy.com/media/uA3HaPHTCyHQc/giphy.gif">





 

Throw racists under the bus?  They should be thrown under buses!  In fact, we had an incident here in Vancouver on the skytrain where a woman went off on an Asian couple.  She got put in her place quickly.  That's how it should be.



You guys talk about the violence of AntiFa and I've denounced it. You talk about freedom of speech, and I've supported it within the law.  But Blazor, it wasn't AntiFa that took away a woman's freedom of speech FOREVER.  Are you intentionally ignoring that fact?

You missed my point that these people have different beliefs. Just like Christianity vs Islam vs Buddhism, etc. Those people still have rights. If someone decides to be racist, shame on them, and thats good that one skytrain woman got put in her place, but they still have their own beliefs and rights. Or perhaps it was one of the other things that I mentioned, a mental disorder, like the guy that ran over that woman. I dont think mentally disturbed people should be thrown under buses, instead should receive proper treatment. (maybe this guy though should get a harsh punishment)



Oh I know it wasnt Antifa, but if not for Antifa she would still be alive. Im not intentionally ignoring that fact, that was the worst thing of that day. But it was an individual from Ohio that was mentally disturbed with a history of it. It wasnt "the racists", one man only.

How did I miss the point when I've condemned AntiFa numerous times?  I have condemn violence at protests?  I've qualified support of free speech.  



You cannot condemn one group for a violent interaction while allowing it from another.  It's NEVER going to fly with me.  Sorry.

[RW]

You are not talking to a listener ... or you would not be still having to say it



As for "denouncing the message of neo nazis?" she needs told that she does not hold the patent on that.

OK. I'll do it. "You do  not hold the patent on that"



In a real world with real people, said once covers it ... Saying something "more often" than others does a saint make



Anyhow, as you made clear Blaze, Nazis are of little effect and certainly not the coming / growing  serious problem for society.



 You have also made clear that Antifa .. Fascits Inc. appears to be rapidly growing into a serious and too real problem .. grabbing onto ANY convenient "cause du jour" (while not necessarily caring a wit about it)    to grow and show their increasing power, threat of violence and actual violence

I'm not talking to a literate bunch given I keep having to repeat my condemnation of AntiFa while watching you guys say sweet fuck all about the underlying issue of racism and bigotry.  Justifying the death of a protestor is just wrong and if it was an Islamist driving that car, you'd be on it like flies on shit.



Hypocrisy noted once again.

[cc]

I have no idea what those say, prolly more of the same  



Just a wild guess ,  it's appropriate to say ... the "page has turned" .



In the overall scheme of things, nazis are a dying breed of nobodies



 There's a new, rapidly growing  and deadly game in town

[RW]

I have no idea what those say, prolly more of the same  



Just a wild guess ,  it's appropriate to say ... the "page has turned" .



 There's a new, rapidly growing  and deadly game in town

And we need to squash it ASAP.



There seems to be this attitude that something is right or wrong based on whether you agree with those committing the acts or not.  That is dangerous thinking.  It's not ok to physically attack people - PERIOD. It doesn't matter the cause.  



Taking sides in an unnecessary violent conflict like this is stupidity personified.  Both these groups should be condemned for their behaviour.  Threats issued for more violence between them should be taken as legally serious and dealt with swiftly and appropriately like throwing some of these organizers in jail for inciting hatred.

[RW]

In the overall scheme of things, nazis are a dying breed of nobodies

Thankfully that's true but that doesn't mean they shouldn't be opposed on mass when the couple hundred of them show up.  It sends a message to the ones who didn't turn out that racism isn't okay.  We can't say that enough frankly (without violence!)

[Anonymous]

I find both the alt right and alt left's views nuts. But, the alt left covers their faces, and uses violence to stop people they disagree  from expressing themselves. That makes them a much bigger danger than the alt right. Not to mention their numbers are a lot larger than the alt right.

[RW]

I find both the alt right and alt left's views nuts. But, the alt left covers their faces, and uses violence to stop people they disagree  from expressing themselves. That makes them a much bigger danger than the alt right. Not to mention their numbers are a lot larger than the alt right.

How many people have the alt-left killed at rallies?



I don't disagree with you and I've said more than once they are opposite sides of the same coin.  That doesn't mean we shouldn't speak out against hatred and racism.

[Anonymous]

In Charlottesville, alt righters applied for and received from the city a permit to hold their rally in the park, and were quietly holding their demonstration when antifa and BLM showed up. I wonder who came to fight.



The same violent actions took place in Quebec City with the anti-illegal immigration group called La Meute being the target. If people cover their faces at public rallies, it's usually for nefarious purposes.

[RW]

In Charlottesville, alt righters applied for and received from the city a permit to hold their rally in the park, and were quietly holding their demonstration when antifa and BLM showed up. I wonder who came to fight.



The same violent actions took place in Quebec City with the anti-illegal immigration group called La Meute being the target. If people cover their faces at public rallies, it's usually for nefarious purposes.

You are incorrect sir.



BLM and AntiFa had city rally permits that day.  Technically the Alt-Righters didn't have a permit because the city wouldn't give them one for that park.  They sought a court injunction and won the right to protest in their desired location.  They did so on a court injunction, not a permit.



They both came to fight.  The righties were armed to the tits and many videos have been released saying they were ready for a fight.  The left came armed and ready to fight. These groups clash regularly.