Title: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 04, 2019, 02:46:20 PM
Post by: Anonymous on March 04, 2019, 02:46:20 PM
The study of five electric vehicles by AAA also found that high temperatures can cut into battery range, but not nearly as much as the cold. The range returns to normal in more comfortable temperatures.
Many owners discovered the range limitations last week when much of the country was in the grips of a polar vortex. Owners of vehicles made by manufacturers including Tesla, the top-selling electric vehicle company in the U.S., complained on social media about reduced range and frozen door handles during the cold snap.
As long as drivers understand that there are limitations when operating electric vehicles in more extreme climates, they are less likely to be caught off guard by an unexpected drop in driving range," Greg Brannon, AAA's director of automotive engineering, said in a statement.
AAA tested the BMW i3s, Chevrolet Bolt and Nissan Leaf from the 2018 model year, and the 2017 Tesla Model S 75D and Volkswagen e-Golf. All have a range of at least 100 miles per charge. They were tested on a dynamometer, which is like a treadmill, in a climate-controlled cell.
The automobile club tested the cars at 20 degrees and 95 degrees, comparing the range to when they were tested at 75 degrees Fahrenheit, according to a report on the study.
At 20 degrees, the average driving range fell by 12 per cent when the car's cabin heater was not used. When the heater was turned on, the range dropped by 41 per cent, AAA said.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 04, 2019, 02:57:32 PM
Post by: Anonymous on March 04, 2019, 02:57:32 PM
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Frood on March 04, 2019, 02:59:56 PM
Post by: Frood on March 04, 2019, 02:59:56 PM
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 04, 2019, 03:08:03 PM
Post by: Anonymous on March 04, 2019, 03:08:03 PM
Cold also cuts down the urge for Boom Boom by at least 40%.Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
And the tests they did were only at -6 celcius..
In the month of February, we had several nights of -30 which would mean they lose much more than 40%.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 04, 2019, 03:13:37 PM
Post by: Anonymous on March 04, 2019, 03:13:37 PM
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: cc on March 04, 2019, 03:17:42 PM
Post by: cc on March 04, 2019, 03:17:42 PM
Cold also cuts down the urge for Boom Boom by at least 40%.Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
Not inside with the fire cracklin
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: cc on March 04, 2019, 03:18:47 PM
Post by: cc on March 04, 2019, 03:18:47 PM
Electric cars are okay I guess for city driving in moderate climates. But, without government subsidies I don't think they could stand on their own two feet.Quote from: "seoulbro"
And if ANY item can't cut long without ongoing govt help, it does not belong
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Frood on March 04, 2019, 03:19:16 PM
Post by: Frood on March 04, 2019, 03:19:16 PM
Cold also cuts down the urge for Boom Boom by at least 40%.Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
And the tests they did were only at -6 celcius..
In the month of February, we had several nights of -30 which would mean they lose much more than 40%.
How can you bear to be bare enough to make babies in that?
Electric cars are okay I guess for city driving in moderate climates. But, without government subsidies I don't think they could stand on their own two feet.Quote from: "seoulbro"
Unless they're being manufactured with and charged with renewable energy like hydro or solar, it's still kicking the can down the road and relying on combustible power plants. Seems like an exercise in carnival card games.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Frood on March 04, 2019, 03:20:39 PM
Post by: Frood on March 04, 2019, 03:20:39 PM
Cold also cuts down the urge for Boom Boom by at least 40%.Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
Not inside with the fire cracklin:sneaky2:
Now I understand the origins of nordic saunas.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: cc on March 04, 2019, 03:20:49 PM
Post by: cc on March 04, 2019, 03:20:49 PM
It is carnivalUnless they're being manufactured with and charged with renewable energy like hydro or solar, it's still kicking the can down the road and relying on combustible power plants. Seems like an exercise in carnival card games.Quote
A hoax
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 04, 2019, 03:38:31 PM
Post by: Anonymous on March 04, 2019, 03:38:31 PM
Unless they're being manufactured with and charged with renewable energy like hydro or solar, it's still kicking the can down the road and relying on combustible power plants. Seems like an exercise in carnival card games.
And than there is the raw materials. Steel and plastics are not made from solar. Which reminds me that solar panels are made from rare earth metals that require a lot of traditional sources of power to extract and refine.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Frood on March 04, 2019, 03:45:58 PM
Post by: Frood on March 04, 2019, 03:45:58 PM
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: JOE on March 04, 2019, 03:46:38 PM
Post by: JOE on March 04, 2019, 03:46:38 PM
If I were to go on the electric route, it'd most likely be a hybrid.
There are simply too many variables which would make electric only vehicles a somewhat risky choice for adverse weather conditions.
They aren't there quite yet. They might be one day but not yet
I suspect the same may be true for hydrogen powered cars Honda made as a prototype
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Frood on March 04, 2019, 03:48:18 PM
Post by: Frood on March 04, 2019, 03:48:18 PM
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 04, 2019, 03:50:17 PM
Post by: Anonymous on March 04, 2019, 03:50:17 PM
Exactly, and newer batteries too.Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
That too. How do we contain the toxic hazards of old batteries. The world is having a hard enough time now with electronic waste.
I know some countries have ambitious plans for e-vehicles, but unless there are huge engineering changes, I don't see how theycan completely supplant combustible engines.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Frood on March 04, 2019, 04:03:24 PM
Post by: Frood on March 04, 2019, 04:03:24 PM
Exactly, and newer batteries too.Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
That too. How do we contain the toxic hazards of old batteries. The world is having a hard enough time now with electronic waste.
I know some countries have ambitious plans for e-vehicles, but unless there are huge engineering changes, I don't see how theycan completely supplant combustible engines.
I agree and there's the environmental cost of trying to power these vehicles once built, with solar, wind, and tidal.
We simply can't put up enough of such things for our populations and if we could, we'd make our planet into a death zone due to stalled weather, wind, tides, and photosynthesis, not to mention the heat it would generate.
Our cleaner energy salvation is off planet, and future technology. Not now. Trying it now would be suicide.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 04, 2019, 04:38:12 PM
Post by: Anonymous on March 04, 2019, 04:38:12 PM
Electric vehicles don't seem like the right type of vehicles for Western Canada's extreme winters.Quote from: "Fashionista"https://www.ctvnews.ca/autos/aaa-cold-weather-can-cut-electric-car-range-over-40-per-cent-1.4286285 DETROIT -- Cold temperatures can sap electric car batteries, temporarily reducing their range by more than 40 per cent when interior heaters are used, a new study found.
The study of five electric vehicles by AAA also found that high temperatures can cut into battery range, but not nearly as much as the cold. The range returns to normal in more comfortable temperatures.
Many owners discovered the range limitations last week when much of the country was in the grips of a polar vortex. Owners of vehicles made by manufacturers including Tesla, the top-selling electric vehicle company in the U.S., complained on social media about reduced range and frozen door handles during the cold snap.
As long as drivers understand that there are limitations when operating electric vehicles in more extreme climates, they are less likely to be caught off guard by an unexpected drop in driving range," Greg Brannon, AAA's director of automotive engineering, said in a statement.
AAA tested the BMW i3s, Chevrolet Bolt and Nissan Leaf from the 2018 model year, and the 2017 Tesla Model S 75D and Volkswagen e-Golf. All have a range of at least 100 miles per charge. They were tested on a dynamometer, which is like a treadmill, in a climate-controlled cell.
The automobile club tested the cars at 20 degrees and 95 degrees, comparing the range to when they were tested at 75 degrees Fahrenheit, according to a report on the study.
At 20 degrees, the average driving range fell by 12 per cent when the car's cabin heater was not used. When the heater was turned on, the range dropped by 41 per cent, AAA said.
No surprises here. I don't need a study to know batteries don't last long in Winnipeg winters.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Bricktop on March 04, 2019, 05:19:49 PM
Post by: Bricktop on March 04, 2019, 05:19:49 PM
Batteries last no time at all when you have grandchildren.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 04, 2019, 06:10:04 PM
Post by: Anonymous on March 04, 2019, 06:10:04 PM
Cold weather? Bah!!!Quote from: "Bricktop"
Batteries last no time at all when you have grandchildren.
I can't wait to wear out batteries that way.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Bricktop on March 04, 2019, 06:35:34 PM
Post by: Bricktop on March 04, 2019, 06:35:34 PM
Battery operated cars, drones, dolls, helicopters and sundry other toys mainly use them.
And they all seem to drain their batteries at the grandparents house!!!
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 04, 2019, 07:04:58 PM
Post by: Anonymous on March 04, 2019, 07:04:58 PM
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 05, 2019, 02:33:49 PM
Post by: Anonymous on March 05, 2019, 02:33:49 PM
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Bricktop on March 05, 2019, 05:20:01 PM
Post by: Bricktop on March 05, 2019, 05:20:01 PM
Is that because every other car on the road "leaf's" it behind?
Geddit? Geddit?
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 05, 2019, 05:46:32 PM
Post by: Anonymous on March 05, 2019, 05:46:32 PM
Why is it called a "Leaf"?Quote from: "Bricktop"
Is that because every other car on the road "leaf's" it behind?
Geddit? Geddit?
:roll:
No, it went right over my head.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Bricktop on March 05, 2019, 07:43:22 PM
Post by: Bricktop on March 05, 2019, 07:43:22 PM
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Gaon on March 05, 2019, 11:14:21 PM
Post by: Gaon on March 05, 2019, 11:14:21 PM
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Bricktop on March 05, 2019, 11:51:05 PM
Post by: Bricktop on March 05, 2019, 11:51:05 PM
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 06, 2019, 12:12:51 AM
Post by: Anonymous on March 06, 2019, 12:12:51 AM
Talk to Joe if you need a tool to drive your truck.Quote from: "Bricktop"
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Zetsu on March 06, 2019, 03:41:26 PM
Post by: Zetsu on March 06, 2019, 03:41:26 PM
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 06, 2019, 03:50:23 PM
Post by: Anonymous on March 06, 2019, 03:50:23 PM
Now that gas has dropped to about a dollar $CAD per litre in Markham, think I'm gonna stick back to my civic hybrid, but most important the tax rebate is now gone for good, lol.Quote from: "Zetsu"
How much was the electric vehicle subsidy in Ontario.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Bricktop on March 06, 2019, 04:04:00 PM
Post by: Bricktop on March 06, 2019, 04:04:00 PM
One person's "subsidy" is another person's increased tax burden.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Zetsu on March 06, 2019, 04:07:16 PM
Post by: Zetsu on March 06, 2019, 04:07:16 PM
Now that gas has dropped to about a dollar $CAD per litre in Markham, think I'm gonna stick back to my civic hybrid, but most important the tax rebate is now gone for good, lol.Quote from: "Zetsu"
How much was the electric vehicle subsidy in Ontario.
Think teh liberals offered 14,000 $CAD for any EV, it was really nothing but a steal until Doug Ford became premier, but then I'm glad he decided to scrap it in the end, it's just kinda stupid to tax the Canadian oil industry and offer incentives for ppl to buy their competitor's products, in the end Trudeau is just really nothing but a piece of horse excrement, as usual.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 06, 2019, 05:47:10 PM
Post by: Anonymous on March 06, 2019, 05:47:10 PM
Now that gas has dropped to about a dollar $CAD per litre in Markham, think I'm gonna stick back to my civic hybrid, but most important the tax rebate is now gone for good, lol.Quote from: "Zetsu"
How much was the electric vehicle subsidy in Ontario.
Think teh liberals offered 14,000 $CAD for any EV, it was really nothing but a steal until Doug Ford became premier, but then I'm glad he decided to scrap it in the end, it's just kinda stupid to tax the Canadian oil industry and offer incentives for ppl to buy their competitor's products, in the end Trudeau is just really nothing but a piece of horse excrement, as usual.
The government should not be using taxpayer money to give certain car manufacturers an unfair advantage over others.
Title: Re: Our planet is not fragile
Post by: Odinson on March 06, 2019, 08:03:52 PM
Post by: Odinson on March 06, 2019, 08:03:52 PM
"The last few years have seen a clear rise in electric vehicles (EVs) with even the world's biggest conventional automakers making plans to go electric. Increasingly, more and more industry experts are speculating we may see a switch to a 100% EV adaption sooner than we think.
Among the many reasons for choosing EVs, perhaps the most compelling one is their universally acknowledged environmentally friendly nature, a much-desired trait in a world threatened by impending climate change.
Now, German automotive consultancy Berylls Strategy Advisors, which describes itself as the "only relevant top management consulting firm working exclusively for the auto industry," is saying EVs may not be the eco-friendly champions the world so desperately needs.
Polluting EV batteries
Before you worry that these electric dream machines may actually release carbon emissions, rest assured this is not the case. Rather the environmental weakness of these cars lies in the production of their lithium-ion batteries, states the consultancy's new research.
Depending on where EVs are manufactured, the energy required to make their batteries results in a high carbon footprint. So high in fact that the automotive experts estimate that an "electric vehicle in Germany would take more than 10 years to break even with an efficient combustion engine's emissions."
"Electric cars appear to be the panacea and reduce emissions by 35 %. After all, electric vehicles do not emit any carbon dioxide while driving – at least that is a widely held opinion," said Dr Jan Burgard, managing partner at Berylls in a LinkedIn statement.
"However, from well to wheel, they do not really improve the situation. After all, electricity generation – including for electric cars – is still strongly dependent on fossil fuels in many EU countries. The climate does not care whether carbon dioxide comes from the exhaust pipe or whether it is released when lignite is burned to generate electricity or in energy-intensive battery production," added Burgard."
Title: Re: Our planet is not fragile
Post by: Wazzzup on March 06, 2019, 08:16:50 PM
Post by: Wazzzup on March 06, 2019, 08:16:50 PM
10 years wow. Another one of those factoids climate changers would hate people to know about.Depending on where EVs are manufactured, the energy required to make their batteries results in a high carbon footprint. So high in fact that the automotive experts estimate that an "electric vehicle in Germany would take more than 10 years to break even with an efficient combustion engine's emissions."Quote from: "Odinson"
I wonder how much CO2 a combustion engine produces, versus, how much CO2 is produced burning fossil fuels to charge an EV's battery.After all, electricity generation – including for electric cars – is still strongly dependent on fossil fuels in many EU countries. The climate does not care whether carbon dioxide comes from the exhaust pipe or whether it is released when lignite is burned to generate electricity or in energy-intensive battery production," added Burgard."Quote from: "Odinson"
Of course now you have to add in production of the battery as well.
Title: Re: Our planet is not fragile
Post by: Anonymous on March 06, 2019, 08:21:10 PM
Post by: Anonymous on March 06, 2019, 08:21:10 PM
Here is something related to electric cars.Quote from: "Odinson"https://interestingengineering.com/diesel-cars-are-cleaner-than-some-evs-new-study-suggests
"The last few years have seen a clear rise in electric vehicles (EVs) with even the world's biggest conventional automakers making plans to go electric. Increasingly, more and more industry experts are speculating we may see a switch to a 100% EV adaption sooner than we think.
Among the many reasons for choosing EVs, perhaps the most compelling one is their universally acknowledged environmentally friendly nature, a much-desired trait in a world threatened by impending climate change.
Now, German automotive consultancy Berylls Strategy Advisors, which describes itself as the "only relevant top management consulting firm working exclusively for the auto industry," is saying EVs may not be the eco-friendly champions the world so desperately needs.
Polluting EV batteries
Before you worry that these electric dream machines may actually release carbon emissions, rest assured this is not the case. Rather the environmental weakness of these cars lies in the production of their lithium-ion batteries, states the consultancy's new research.
Depending on where EVs are manufactured, the energy required to make their batteries results in a high carbon footprint. So high in fact that the automotive experts estimate that an "electric vehicle in Germany would take more than 10 years to break even with an efficient combustion engine's emissions."
"Electric cars appear to be the panacea and reduce emissions by 35 %. After all, electric vehicles do not emit any carbon dioxide while driving – at least that is a widely held opinion," said Dr Jan Burgard, managing partner at Berylls in a LinkedIn statement.
"However, from well to wheel, they do not really improve the situation. After all, electricity generation – including for electric cars – is still strongly dependent on fossil fuels in many EU countries. The climate does not care whether carbon dioxide comes from the exhaust pipe or whether it is released when lignite is burned to generate electricity or in energy-intensive battery production," added Burgard."
I moved this post here Odi..
It's about electric vehicles, so fits here.
Title: Re: Our planet is not fragile
Post by: Odinson on March 06, 2019, 08:22:54 PM
Post by: Odinson on March 06, 2019, 08:22:54 PM
Here is something related to electric cars.Quote from: "Odinson"https://interestingengineering.com/diesel-cars-are-cleaner-than-some-evs-new-study-suggests
"The last few years have seen a clear rise in electric vehicles (EVs) with even the world's biggest conventional automakers making plans to go electric. Increasingly, more and more industry experts are speculating we may see a switch to a 100% EV adaption sooner than we think.
Among the many reasons for choosing EVs, perhaps the most compelling one is their universally acknowledged environmentally friendly nature, a much-desired trait in a world threatened by impending climate change.
Now, German automotive consultancy Berylls Strategy Advisors, which describes itself as the "only relevant top management consulting firm working exclusively for the auto industry," is saying EVs may not be the eco-friendly champions the world so desperately needs.
Polluting EV batteries
Before you worry that these electric dream machines may actually release carbon emissions, rest assured this is not the case. Rather the environmental weakness of these cars lies in the production of their lithium-ion batteries, states the consultancy's new research.
Depending on where EVs are manufactured, the energy required to make their batteries results in a high carbon footprint. So high in fact that the automotive experts estimate that an "electric vehicle in Germany would take more than 10 years to break even with an efficient combustion engine's emissions."
"Electric cars appear to be the panacea and reduce emissions by 35 %. After all, electric vehicles do not emit any carbon dioxide while driving – at least that is a widely held opinion," said Dr Jan Burgard, managing partner at Berylls in a LinkedIn statement.
"However, from well to wheel, they do not really improve the situation. After all, electricity generation – including for electric cars – is still strongly dependent on fossil fuels in many EU countries. The climate does not care whether carbon dioxide comes from the exhaust pipe or whether it is released when lignite is burned to generate electricity or in energy-intensive battery production," added Burgard."
I moved this post here Odi..
It's about electric vehicles, so fits here.
You know, I was sure you posted something similar but I couldnt find it in the thread so...
Title: Re: Our planet is not fragile
Post by: Anonymous on March 06, 2019, 08:25:24 PM
Post by: Anonymous on March 06, 2019, 08:25:24 PM
Here is something related to electric cars.Quote from: "Odinson"https://interestingengineering.com/diesel-cars-are-cleaner-than-some-evs-new-study-suggests
"The last few years have seen a clear rise in electric vehicles (EVs) with even the world's biggest conventional automakers making plans to go electric. Increasingly, more and more industry experts are speculating we may see a switch to a 100% EV adaption sooner than we think.
Among the many reasons for choosing EVs, perhaps the most compelling one is their universally acknowledged environmentally friendly nature, a much-desired trait in a world threatened by impending climate change.
Now, German automotive consultancy Berylls Strategy Advisors, which describes itself as the "only relevant top management consulting firm working exclusively for the auto industry," is saying EVs may not be the eco-friendly champions the world so desperately needs.
Polluting EV batteries
Before you worry that these electric dream machines may actually release carbon emissions, rest assured this is not the case. Rather the environmental weakness of these cars lies in the production of their lithium-ion batteries, states the consultancy's new research.
Depending on where EVs are manufactured, the energy required to make their batteries results in a high carbon footprint. So high in fact that the automotive experts estimate that an "electric vehicle in Germany would take more than 10 years to break even with an efficient combustion engine's emissions."
"Electric cars appear to be the panacea and reduce emissions by 35 %. After all, electric vehicles do not emit any carbon dioxide while driving – at least that is a widely held opinion," said Dr Jan Burgard, managing partner at Berylls in a LinkedIn statement.
"However, from well to wheel, they do not really improve the situation. After all, electricity generation – including for electric cars – is still strongly dependent on fossil fuels in many EU countries. The climate does not care whether carbon dioxide comes from the exhaust pipe or whether it is released when lignite is burned to generate electricity or in energy-intensive battery production," added Burgard."
I moved this post here Odi..
It's about electric vehicles, so fits here.
You know, I was sure you posted something similar but I couldnt find it in the thread so...ac_biggrin
I don't recall.
Title: Re: Our planet is not fragile
Post by: Odinson on March 06, 2019, 08:27:59 PM
Post by: Odinson on March 06, 2019, 08:27:59 PM
Here is something related to electric cars.Quote from: "Odinson"https://interestingengineering.com/diesel-cars-are-cleaner-than-some-evs-new-study-suggests
"The last few years have seen a clear rise in electric vehicles (EVs) with even the world's biggest conventional automakers making plans to go electric. Increasingly, more and more industry experts are speculating we may see a switch to a 100% EV adaption sooner than we think.
Among the many reasons for choosing EVs, perhaps the most compelling one is their universally acknowledged environmentally friendly nature, a much-desired trait in a world threatened by impending climate change.
Now, German automotive consultancy Berylls Strategy Advisors, which describes itself as the "only relevant top management consulting firm working exclusively for the auto industry," is saying EVs may not be the eco-friendly champions the world so desperately needs.
Polluting EV batteries
Before you worry that these electric dream machines may actually release carbon emissions, rest assured this is not the case. Rather the environmental weakness of these cars lies in the production of their lithium-ion batteries, states the consultancy's new research.
Depending on where EVs are manufactured, the energy required to make their batteries results in a high carbon footprint. So high in fact that the automotive experts estimate that an "electric vehicle in Germany would take more than 10 years to break even with an efficient combustion engine's emissions."
"Electric cars appear to be the panacea and reduce emissions by 35 %. After all, electric vehicles do not emit any carbon dioxide while driving – at least that is a widely held opinion," said Dr Jan Burgard, managing partner at Berylls in a LinkedIn statement.
"However, from well to wheel, they do not really improve the situation. After all, electricity generation – including for electric cars – is still strongly dependent on fossil fuels in many EU countries. The climate does not care whether carbon dioxide comes from the exhaust pipe or whether it is released when lignite is burned to generate electricity or in energy-intensive battery production," added Burgard."
I moved this post here Odi..
It's about electric vehicles, so fits here.
You know, I was sure you posted something similar but I couldnt find it in the thread so...ac_biggrin
I don't recall.
ac_umm
Yes.. I was remembering the content of this thread..
Title: Re: Our planet is not fragile
Post by: Odinson on March 06, 2019, 08:32:11 PM
Post by: Odinson on March 06, 2019, 08:32:11 PM
Depending on where EVs are manufactured, the energy required to make their batteries results in a high carbon footprint. So high in fact that the automotive experts estimate that an "electric vehicle in Germany would take more than 10 years to break even with an efficient combustion engine's emissions."Quote from: "Odinson"I wonder how much CO2 a combustion engine produces, versus, how much CO2 is produced burning fossil fuels to charge an EV's battery.After all, electricity generation – including for electric cars – is still strongly dependent on fossil fuels in many EU countries. The climate does not care whether carbon dioxide comes from the exhaust pipe or whether it is released when lignite is burned to generate electricity or in energy-intensive battery production," added Burgard."Quote from: "Odinson"
Of course now you have to add in production of the battery as well.
https://i1.wp.com/www.bookwormroom.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/Climate-change-electric-cars-shift-pollution.jpg
They never really think about the logistics and production.
They are thinking about increasing our power requirements to a whole new level.. Because electricity comes from the wall socket and its clean.
A lot of people in the business are aware that green energy products dont really save the planet because the production pollution is way higher.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Odinson on March 06, 2019, 08:35:41 PM
Post by: Odinson on March 06, 2019, 08:35:41 PM
Cold also cuts down the urge for Boom Boom by at least 40%.Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
And the tests they did were only at -6 celcius..
In the month of February, we had several nights of -30 which would mean they lose much more than 40%.
And we all know how other battery powered products fare in the cold..
My phone saps a lot quicker in the cold.
And its not due to me upping the phone heater..
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 06, 2019, 08:41:38 PM
Post by: Anonymous on March 06, 2019, 08:41:38 PM
Cold also cuts down the urge for Boom Boom by at least 40%.Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
And the tests they did were only at -6 celcius..
In the month of February, we had several nights of -30 which would mean they lose much more than 40%.
And we all know how other battery powered products fare in the cold..
My phone saps a lot quicker in the cold.
And its not due to me upping the phone heater..
Batteries don't like cold weather.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Odinson on March 06, 2019, 08:55:26 PM
Post by: Odinson on March 06, 2019, 08:55:26 PM
Cold also cuts down the urge for Boom Boom by at least 40%.Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
And the tests they did were only at -6 celcius..
In the month of February, we had several nights of -30 which would mean they lose much more than 40%.
And we all know how other battery powered products fare in the cold..
My phone saps a lot quicker in the cold.
And its not due to me upping the phone heater..
Batteries don't like cold weather.
The canadian winter kills the battery entirely.. And you cant recharge it until you get the car into a warm garage..
Recharging it would put the battery out of commission.
One can only imagine how much the battery costs when a small drill battery costs 50 bucks.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 06, 2019, 09:04:43 PM
Post by: Anonymous on March 06, 2019, 09:04:43 PM
Cold also cuts down the urge for Boom Boom by at least 40%.Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
And the tests they did were only at -6 celcius..
In the month of February, we had several nights of -30 which would mean they lose much more than 40%.
And we all know how other battery powered products fare in the cold..
My phone saps a lot quicker in the cold.
And its not due to me upping the phone heater..
Batteries don't like cold weather.
The canadian winter kills the battery entirely.. And you cant recharge it until you get the car into a warm garage..
Recharging it would put the battery out of commission.
One can only imagine how much the battery costs when a small drill battery costs 50 bucks.
I have no idea how much an electric vehicle battery costs or how long they last..
Zetsu probably knows.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Zetsu on March 08, 2019, 10:51:57 AM
Post by: Zetsu on March 08, 2019, 10:51:57 AM
Now that gas has dropped to about a dollar $CAD per litre in Markham, think I'm gonna stick back to my civic hybrid, but most important the tax rebate is now gone for good, lol.Quote from: "Zetsu"
How much was the electric vehicle subsidy in Ontario.
Think teh liberals offered 14,000 $CAD for any EV, it was really nothing but a steal until Doug Ford became premier, but then I'm glad he decided to scrap it in the end, it's just kinda stupid to tax the Canadian oil industry and offer incentives for ppl to buy their competitor's products, in the end Trudeau is just really nothing but a piece of horse excrement, as usual.
The government should not be using taxpayer money to give certain car manufacturers an unfair advantage over others.
I'm with ya brother, tbh it was pretty tempting, but I'm more happy the incentive is now gone for good in Ontario.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 08, 2019, 10:56:36 AM
Post by: Anonymous on March 08, 2019, 10:56:36 AM
Now that gas has dropped to about a dollar $CAD per litre in Markham, think I'm gonna stick back to my civic hybrid, but most important the tax rebate is now gone for good, lol.Quote from: "Zetsu"
How much was the electric vehicle subsidy in Ontario.
Think teh liberals offered 14,000 $CAD for any EV, it was really nothing but a steal until Doug Ford became premier, but then I'm glad he decided to scrap it in the end, it's just kinda stupid to tax the Canadian oil industry and offer incentives for ppl to buy their competitor's products, in the end Trudeau is just really nothing but a piece of horse excrement, as usual.
The government should not be using taxpayer money to give certain car manufacturers an unfair advantage over others.
I'm with ya brother, tbh it was pretty tempting, but I'm more happy the incentive is now gone for good in Ontario.ac_drinks
Brother, don't get me wrong. I don't blame anyone for taking advantage of those generous subsidies. But, the government using taxpayer money to give an unfair advantage to certain auto manufacturers is not a free market.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Zetsu on March 09, 2019, 07:59:22 PM
Post by: Zetsu on March 09, 2019, 07:59:22 PM
Cold also cuts down the urge for Boom Boom by at least 40%.Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
And the tests they did were only at -6 celcius..
In the month of February, we had several nights of -30 which would mean they lose much more than 40%.
And we all know how other battery powered products fare in the cold..
My phone saps a lot quicker in the cold.
And its not due to me upping the phone heater..
Batteries don't like cold weather.
The canadian winter kills the battery entirely.. And you cant recharge it until you get the car into a warm garage..
Recharging it would put the battery out of commission.
One can only imagine how much the battery costs when a small drill battery costs 50 bucks.
I have no idea how much an electric vehicle battery costs or how long they last..
Zetsu probably knows.
I believe it really depends on teh kilowatt of the battery, but even for the most affordable EVs, it's battery cost no less than $15,000 CAD or $11,200 USDs. For Tesla cars, if they condition the battery properly most should be able to drive up to 1 million kilometers before losing 1 quarter of it's capacity.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Odinson on March 09, 2019, 08:05:56 PM
Post by: Odinson on March 09, 2019, 08:05:56 PM
Cold also cuts down the urge for Boom Boom by at least 40%.Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
And the tests they did were only at -6 celcius..
In the month of February, we had several nights of -30 which would mean they lose much more than 40%.
And we all know how other battery powered products fare in the cold..
My phone saps a lot quicker in the cold.
And its not due to me upping the phone heater..
Batteries don't like cold weather.
The canadian winter kills the battery entirely.. And you cant recharge it until you get the car into a warm garage..
Recharging it would put the battery out of commission.
One can only imagine how much the battery costs when a small drill battery costs 50 bucks.
I have no idea how much an electric vehicle battery costs or how long they last..
Zetsu probably knows.
I believe it really depends on teh kilowatt of the battery, but even for the most affordable EVs, it's battery cost no less than $15,000 CAD or $11,200 USDs. For Tesla cars, if they condition the battery properly most should be able to drive up to 1 million kilometers before losing 1 quarter of it's capacity.
Nice.. You cant charge the battery during winter if the vehicle is outside..
And you cant drive it because of the cold.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 10, 2019, 02:03:45 PM
Post by: Anonymous on March 10, 2019, 02:03:45 PM
Cold also cuts down the urge for Boom Boom by at least 40%.Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
And the tests they did were only at -6 celcius..
In the month of February, we had several nights of -30 which would mean they lose much more than 40%.
And we all know how other battery powered products fare in the cold..
My phone saps a lot quicker in the cold.
And its not due to me upping the phone heater..
Batteries don't like cold weather.
The canadian winter kills the battery entirely.. And you cant recharge it until you get the car into a warm garage..
Recharging it would put the battery out of commission.
One can only imagine how much the battery costs when a small drill battery costs 50 bucks.
I have no idea how much an electric vehicle battery costs or how long they last..
Zetsu probably knows.
I believe it really depends on teh kilowatt of the battery, but even for the most affordable EVs, it's battery cost no less than $15,000 CAD or $11,200 USDs. For Tesla cars, if they condition the battery properly most should be able to drive up to 1 million kilometers before losing 1 quarter of it's capacity.
That isn't spare change. Do that twice over the lifetime of your car. No thanks to e-cars.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 10, 2019, 08:00:45 PM
Post by: Anonymous on March 10, 2019, 08:00:45 PM
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Bricktop on March 11, 2019, 12:24:32 AM
Post by: Bricktop on March 11, 2019, 12:24:32 AM
I guess they think the power that charges their batteries comes out of a unicorn's ass.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 11, 2019, 12:53:43 AM
Post by: Anonymous on March 11, 2019, 12:53:43 AM
Watched the Formula E car race last night. The pious and sanctimonious celebrities on pit lane were lauding the format as a "zero emission" car race.Quote from: "Bricktop"
I guess they think the power that charges their batteries comes out of a unicorn's ass.
You mean it doesn't come from a unicorn's ass.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Bricktop on March 11, 2019, 02:04:18 AM
Post by: Bricktop on March 11, 2019, 02:04:18 AM
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 11, 2019, 02:13:41 AM
Post by: Anonymous on March 11, 2019, 02:13:41 AM
Well, I didn't see any unicorns in the pits.Quote from: "Bricktop"
Can't say I have either.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Bricktop on March 12, 2019, 01:02:20 AM
Post by: Bricktop on March 12, 2019, 01:02:20 AM
Range is not the stumbling block. It's how long it takes before you can get going again.
If e-cars were the future, every cab would be an e-car...but then they'd be sitting idly for hours until the battery comes up.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Gaon on March 12, 2019, 01:21:37 AM
Post by: Gaon on March 12, 2019, 01:21:37 AM
E cars won't go anywhere until they can resolve the re-charging issue.Quote from: "Bricktop"
Range is not the stumbling block. It's how long it takes before you can get going again.
If e-cars were the future, every cab would be an e-car...but then they'd be sitting idly for hours until the battery comes up.
And has been said already, in a cold country like Canada, the battery doesn't last as long as in mild climates.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Bricktop on March 12, 2019, 02:28:39 AM
Post by: Bricktop on March 12, 2019, 02:28:39 AM
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 12, 2019, 09:08:15 AM
Post by: Anonymous on March 12, 2019, 09:08:15 AM
Dead end technology.Quote from: "Bricktop"
Electric vehicles would've been unreliable in the February we had.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: cc on March 12, 2019, 02:56:04 PM
Post by: cc on March 12, 2019, 02:56:04 PM
I guess they think the power that charges their batteries comes out of a unicorn's ass.Quote
I posted this before, but it's appropriate here in the overall sense (or lack of sense)
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 12, 2019, 03:00:38 PM
Post by: Anonymous on March 12, 2019, 03:00:38 PM
I guess they think the power that charges their batteries comes out of a unicorn's ass.Quote
I posted this before, but it's appropriate here in the overall sense (or lack of sense)(//%3C/s%3E%3CURL%20url=%22https://www.blazingcatfur.ca/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/electric-car-climate-change-agw-global-warming-400x288.jpg%22%3E%3CLINK_TEXT%20text=%22https://www.blazingcatfur.ca/wp-content%20...%2000x288.jpg%22%3Ehttps://www.blazingcatfur.ca/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/electric-car-climate-change-agw-global-warming-400x288.jpg%3C/LINK_TEXT%3E%3C/URL%3E%3Ce%3E)
Even if the energy came from hydro electric, at various stages of the process, fossil fuels are used.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Bricktop on March 12, 2019, 07:14:54 PM
Post by: Bricktop on March 12, 2019, 07:14:54 PM
Hydrogen cars are not an option, because of the volatility of liquid hydrogen, and the extreme danger and difficulty in transporting it to refuelling depots. The common fuel station would have to be completely re-designed to make liquid hydrogen re-fuelling safe.
The elimination of fossil fuels will not be the death of vehicles that use that fuel. It will be the death of individually private owned transport.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Anonymous on March 12, 2019, 07:23:22 PM
Post by: Anonymous on March 12, 2019, 07:23:22 PM
If every vehicle in the world became electric, there would not be enough base load to power them. The energy has to come from somewhere.Quote from: "Bricktop"
Hydrogen cars are not an option, because of the volatility of liquid hydrogen, and the extreme danger and difficulty in transporting it to refuelling depots. The common fuel station would have to be completely re-designed to make liquid hydrogen re-fuelling safe.
The elimination of fossil fuels will not be the death of vehicles that use that fuel. It will be the death of individually private owned transport.
Nobody seriously believes fossil fuels and petrochemicals will ever completely die.
Title: Re: AAA: Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40 per cent
Post by: Thiel on March 12, 2019, 08:24:33 PM
Post by: Thiel on March 12, 2019, 08:24:33 PM