Title: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on June 21, 2019, 05:25:24 PM
Post by: Anonymous on June 21, 2019, 05:25:24 PM
By Lorrie Goldstien
A new report by the Fraser Institute debunks the most common defence of carbon taxes by the Trudeau government, the Green party and other supporters — that the cost of doing nothing exceeds the cost of taking action.
The report by University of Guelph economist Ross Mckitrick for the fiscally conservative think-tank — titled "Apples to apples: Making valid cost-benefit comparisons in climate policies" — says the problem is that politicians don't understand basic economics.
This leads to inaccurate claims, as made recently by the Green Party of Ontario, Mckitrick says, that the cost of climate change to the Canadian economy will be over $91 billion annually by 2050 without a federal carbon tax — currently $20 per tonne of industrial greenhouse gas emissions, rising to $50 per tonne in 2022.
The problem is this makes a false comparison between the cost of the carbon tax in Canada and the impact it will have on reducing the costs of human-induced climate change globally, known as a total-versus marginal error.
"People often compare the wrong things when trying to decide if a policy is worth pursuing" Mckitrick said.
"If one person comments on the high cost of a proposed policy and someone retorts that it is a small amount compared to the costs of climate change, that is a fallacy because the two are not alternatives. We cannot trade off the marginal cost of a policy against the benefit of eliminating the total costs of all climate change because the policy will not achieve anything on that scale. The proper comparison is between the cost of the policy and the benefits attributable to only that policy. "Claiming that a Canadian climate policy would stop all climate change exaggerates its benefits. Since Canada represents about 2% of global carbon dioxide emissions, policies such as the recently implemented federal carbon tax will reduce total global emissions only by a fraction of 1%, which will have a very small effect on the global climate."
The second common mistake political supporters of carbon taxes make, Mckitrick added, is known as "the-social-versus private error" which considers carbon taxes in isolation from other taxation policies and ignores the ways in which these policies interact.
Both of these errors, he said, exaggerate the benefits of Canadian carbon taxation policies and make a false economic case for ever-increasing carbon taxes.
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on June 21, 2019, 05:45:27 PM
Post by: Anonymous on June 21, 2019, 05:45:27 PM
Even their card carrying members knew that was an exaggeration.
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on June 21, 2019, 06:30:03 PM
Post by: Anonymous on June 21, 2019, 06:30:03 PM
Even Prime Minister Justin Trudeau has admitted that.
But what if Canada could help the world's largest polluters cut their greenhouse gas emissions by an appreciable amount?
That could be the equivalent of wiping many Canadas off the map entirely in terms of creating emissions that cause global warming. It would go a long way toward solving the so-called climate emergency.
This idea is the third policy principle of the Conservative Party of Canada's long-awaited climate action plan entitled A Real Plan to Protect Our Environment, released Wednesday afternoon. It's an initiative that should have been done a long time ago.
We've all heard the expression that when it comes to helping the environment we should "think globally and act locally." That remains true. But when it comes to reducing greenhouse gas emissions, what really should happen is to think globally and act globally.
"Greenhouse gas emissions do not recognize borders," Conservative Party Leader Andrew Scheer said in a Wednesday evening speech in Chelsea, Que.
"Canada could stop everything tomorrow. Oilsands. Mining. Manufacturing. Agriculture. Everything. And it would mean almost nothing," said Sheer, referring to Canada producing just 1.6 per cent of the world's global man-made greenhouse gas emissions.
"We don't do the world any favours by driving investment and jobs away from Canada — where energy is cleaner and environmental standards are higher — and into the welcoming arms of countries with dirtier sources of energy and lower environmental standards. Under that scenario, everybody loses," he said.
"If you shut down Canada's entire economy for a year, China would replace all of our emissions in three weeks." China produces 27 per cent of the world's greenhouse gas emissions. Coal makes up 59 per cent of China's total energy consumption but produced more than 70 per cent of energy-related C02 emissions in 2018, according to Jan Ivar Korsbakken and Robbie Andrew, senior researchers in climate economics at the CICERO Center for International Climate Research in Norway.
Scheer even quoted Prime Minister Justin Trudeau as saying: 'Even if Canada stopped everything tomorrow, and the other countries didn't have any solutions, it wouldn't make a big difference.' "
That's a fact.
"We have to look beyond our borders. This is the fresh new perspective Canada needs and as prime minister it will be mine," said Scheer, who also announced initiatives to incentivize green technology, bring in a green home tax credit — since 12 per cent of Canada's total greenhouse gas emissions come from buildings — and to lower the tax rate from 15 per cent to five per cent on income earned from the patent of a new green technology.
Scheer pointed out that Canada's liquefied natural gas, or LNG, could dramatically reduce China's reliance on coal — the biggest and baddest of all fossil fuels in terms of CO2 emissions.
He also said Canada's carbon capture and storage expertise, if outfitted on just 100 of China's 3,000 coal plants, would cut 300 megatonnes of greenhouse gas emissions every year — which is nearly half of what Canada's entire economy produces in a year.
This idea is music to the ears of University of British Columbia Professor Wenran Jiang, because it is a tune he's been singing since 2011.
Jiang, the director of the Canada-China Energy & Environment Forum at the Institute of Asian Research at UBC, has been trying to sell this idea to politicians and policy-makers for a long time.
"China's problem is it uses too much coal and converts its coal into liquid and gas, which lowers the amount of pollutants in the lower atmosphere but at the same time emits more CO2 into the atmosphere, so I've been advocating for almost a decade now for more environmental logic on the global level to say, look folks, before the renewables and alternative energy sources finally take over we need some transitional solutions. The transitional fuels — oil, heavy oil included, and LNG especially are needed — as a transitional solution to replace coal use in China. That will result in significant net GHG reductions globally," said Jiang, who was interviewed Wednesday night in Calgary.
"If you really want to take care of climate change, this is the way to go in the short and medium term," added Jiang. "This isn't an opinion. These are the facts. This is the only way to go.
"I think gradually people are moving beyond narrow, parochial, regional, provincial and national borders. Finally people are beginning to realize how important it is if we are to combat climate change and reduce CO2 emissions, the only way to do it is through global means. Any local initiatives, as important as they are, need to be part of global efforts, otherwise it could be totally lost. If we don't look at this problem globally, any incremental efforts Canada makes is a lost cause," said Jiang.
It's long past time to tackle climate change with a holistic global approach by thinking globally and acting globally.
Sorry Liz May, your beloved carbon tax on working families will not move the climate needle one iota let alone save $91 billion.
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on June 21, 2019, 07:07:18 PM
Post by: Anonymous on June 21, 2019, 07:07:18 PM
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on June 21, 2019, 07:54:26 PM
Post by: Anonymous on June 21, 2019, 07:54:26 PM
Trudeau and May are liars. We all know that.Quote from: "iron horse jockey"
They're politicians.
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on June 21, 2019, 09:28:17 PM
Post by: Anonymous on June 21, 2019, 09:28:17 PM
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on August 27, 2019, 12:27:13 PM
Post by: Anonymous on August 27, 2019, 12:27:13 PM
Any politician can flip-flop on an issue.
But it takes a true mastery of the art form, as displayed by Environment and Climate Change Minister Catherine McKenna, to flip-flop twice in two months and end up exactly where she was before the first flip.
Not only that, but with her second flip-flop McKenna revived a dormant political controversy by raising the possibility Prime Minister Justin Trudeau might raise carbon taxes beyond $50 per tonne of emissions after 2022, if he wins the Oct. 21 election.
Conservative MP Pierre Poilievre said with McKenna's latest flip-flop, "the cat's out of the bag," meaning the Liberals will keep raising Trudeau's carbon tax if they're re-elected, which Conservative Leader Andrew Scheer has pledged to scrap.
In response, McKenna denied the Liberals have already decided to raise the carbon tax after 2022, which will be the subject of future negotiations with the provinces.
Here's how we got here.
On Sunday, McKenna told the Globe and Mail the Trudeau government, if it wins re-election, might hike Trudeau's carbon tax above $50 per tonne after 2022.
That was a flip-flop from McKenna's position in June, when she announced out of the blue that Trudeau's annual carbon tax would be permanently capped at $50 per tonne after 2022.
And that was a flip-flop from the Trudeau government's position prior to June, which was that it would examine whether to hike the carbon tax higher than $50 per tonne after 2022, if it was re-elected in October.
At that time, I wrote McKenna's election promise to permanently freeze Trudeau's carbon tax at $50 per tonne after 2022 was ludicrous, because she was simultaneously promising Canada will meet its greenhouse gas reduction targets under the United Nations' Paris climate accord, which Trudeau agreed to in 2015.
Trudeau has pledged to reduce Canada's emissions to 30% below 2005 levels by 2030.
Credible, independent bodies that have examined that claim have concluded Canada's carbon price will have to rise dramatically after 2022, in the range of $100 to $300 per tonne of emissions, to meet Trudeau's 2030 target.
That would dramatically raise the price of almost all goods and services because of their dependence on fossil fuels, which would be a job-killing economic disaster, unless Trudeau keeps his promise that his carbon tax will always be revenue neutral, rebating most of the money to Canadians.
What's inexplicable is why McKenna changed the government's policy on carbon pricing twice in two months, re-opening the prospect Canadians could be paying far higher carbon taxes after 2022, if the Liberals win re-election.
How can we trust anything McKenna or Trudeau say about carbon taxes during the election campaign, given these two policy reversals in two months?
Remember, McKenna was captured on video in May at Christian's Pub in St. John's, N.L. after being "screeched in", enthusiastically proclaiming her belief, "that if you actually say it louder, we've learned in the House of Commons, if you repeat it, if you say it louder, if that is your talking point, people will totally believe it."
Asked Monday if she would start negotiating with the provinces on the issue of Trudeau's post-2022 carbon tax prior to the 2023 federal election, if the Liberals are re-elected Oct. 21, McKenna responded, "Gosh, I'm just worried about getting re-elected (in 2019), earning the right to represent Ottawa Centre."
We will all be paying a lot more for everything WHEN Trudeau is reelected in fifty five days.
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on August 27, 2019, 05:53:15 PM
Post by: Anonymous on August 27, 2019, 05:53:15 PM
He's so out of touch with the struggles of working families.
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on August 27, 2019, 07:48:28 PM
Post by: Anonymous on August 27, 2019, 07:48:28 PM
rJustin Trudeau thinks families like mine pick money off of trees..Quote from: "Fashionista"
He's so out of touch with the struggles of working families.
He thinks every Canadian has a trust fund.
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on August 28, 2019, 04:12:06 PM
Post by: Anonymous on August 28, 2019, 04:12:06 PM
It looks likely that Liberal government will increase carbon tax if re-elected
Really!? Seriously!? There are actually Canadian voters who think the Trudeau Liberals can be trusted to keep their promise not to raise the federal carbon tax above $50 a tonne (about 12 cents per litre of gasoline) if they win re-election?
Of course they'll raise the tax if they win October's general election. How do I know? Because Liberal MPS have done more flipping on the subject this summer than most of them did at pancake breakfasts back home in their ridings.
When it has looked as if they might win support from middle-class suburban voters this fall — like, say, before the federal ethics commissioner's report scared voters off — the Libs promised a cap on the tax of $50 a tonne.
The tax is widely unpopular, so any party looking for broad-based support cannot push it too high. Middle-class voters will pay some premium towards saving the environment, but not much.
However, after Justin Trudeau's latest ethics scandal put a hard ceiling on Liberal support, party strategists started thinking it was more important to keep core Liberals happy than to woo middle-of-the-road voters. Preserve the base and settle for a minority rather than swing for the centre-field fence and possibly lose.
And since core Liberal supporters are more "green" (because they are younger, more urban and less likely to own a car they have to refuel), some prominent Liberals started musing aloud about jackassing up the tax beyond $50 a tonne after 2022.
In a nutshell, Liberal Environment Minister Catherine Mckenna pledged in June that the carbon tax would never go higher than $50.
Because polls show that around two-thirds of voters oppose the tax, the $50 cap was a promise she and other ministers repeated at least three times.
But last month, the Liberals nominated a high-profile and vocal environmentalist, Steven Guilbeault, in a Montreal riding — a man who had earlier and forcefully said $50 a tonne was nowhere near high enough to encourage ordinary Canadians to change their use of fossil fuels enough to lower our country's emissions.
Then this past weekend, Mckenna herself failed to rule out a jump in the tax after it reaches the $50 level in 2022, despite her earlier assurances.
The minister's latest remarks — that the tax might have to go higher — drew praise from Guilbeault who called it "a very good thing" and added that the "price should reflect the cost of climate change to society."
We know the Liberals have an internal report from Environment Canada that estimates the carbon tax will have to rise to between $135 and $300 a tonne if Canada is to achieve the goal it promised the U.N. of reducing carbon emissions to 30 per cent below 2005 levels by 2030.
And we know the U.N. itself estimates carbon taxes may have to rise to as much as $5,500 a tonne if the world is to achieve the emission reductions promised at the Paris climate conference in 2015.
So just to satisfy their climate obsession, you can bet the Liberals are going to raise the tax if they are re-elected in a couple of months.
But the Liberals will also push their carbon tax up to $75 a tonne, $100, $150 because it is a "halo tax." In other words, it is a tax a lot of Liberal and lefty voters don't mind paying because it makes them feel like they're doing something for a good cause.
Raise the income tax or GST to bring in a similar amount of government revenue and plenty of voters would balk. But raise the save-the-planet tax and while support may be grudging, opposition will be nowhere near as vocal (or politically damaging to the Liberals).
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on August 28, 2019, 07:14:41 PM
Post by: Anonymous on August 28, 2019, 07:14:41 PM
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on August 29, 2019, 11:19:50 AM
Post by: Anonymous on August 29, 2019, 11:19:50 AM
It appears Prime Minister Justin Trudeau and Environment Minister Catherine Mckenna will be perfectly happy if Canadians have no idea where their carbon tax will be heading if the Liberals win the Oct. 21 election.
Mckenna's flip-flops over the past two months have been a case study in incoherency and confusion.
Prior to June, the government said its gradually increasing carbon tax, which will hit $50 per tonne of greenhouse gas emissions in 2022, would be reviewed at that time to see if it should be made more "stringent" (translation, "higher") going forward.
Then the Parliamentary Budget Office (PBO) released a report in mid-june saying Trudeau's carbon tax would need to be more than doubled to $102 per tonne by 2030, to meet Trudeau's commitment under the UN'S Paris climate accord to reduce Canada's emissions to 30% below 2005 levels by 2030.
(Other studies have said the tax will have to be as high as $300 per tonne.)
In response to the PBO report, Mckenna said Trudeau's carbon tax would be frozen at $50 per tonne in 2022 and the government will use other means to achieve its targets.
Then she reversed course this week, telling the Globe and Mail it's possible the tax will be raised above
$50 per tonne in 2022, depending on consultations with the provinces.
She denied an allegation by the Conservatives that Trudeau has already decided to hike his carbon tax after 2022, which is not the same as saying it won't happen.
Her obfuscation, and
Trudeau's, is irresponsible.
What better time is there than an election campaign for Trudeau and Mckenna to come clean — pardon the pun — on their intentions for their carbon tax?
Premier Doug Ford's government announced Wednesday Ontario will appeal to the Supreme Court of Canada its earlier loss at the Ontario Court of Appeal, which found Trudeau's Greenhouse Gas Pollution Pricing Act is constitutional.
But in the real world, the fate of Trudeau's carbon tax will be decided in the Oct. 21 election.
If Trudeau is going to be honest with Canadians, he needs to explain now, not after the election, what his intentions are.
Alarmingly, as we have seen in scandals like Lavscam, honesty is not one of his strong suits.
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on August 30, 2019, 12:29:39 AM
Post by: Anonymous on August 30, 2019, 12:29:39 AM
Trudeau must come clean on carbon taxes
It appears Prime Minister Justin Trudeau and Environment Minister Catherine Mckenna will be perfectly happy if Canadians have no idea where their carbon tax will be heading if the Liberals win the Oct. 21 election.
Mckenna's flip-flops over the past two months have been a case study in incoherency and confusion.
Prior to June, the government said its gradually increasing carbon tax, which will hit $50 per tonne of greenhouse gas emissions in 2022, would be reviewed at that time to see if it should be made more "stringent" (translation, "higher") going forward.
Then the Parliamentary Budget Office (PBO) released a report in mid-june saying Trudeau's carbon tax would need to be more than doubled to $102 per tonne by 2030, to meet Trudeau's commitment under the UN'S Paris climate accord to reduce Canada's emissions to 30% below 2005 levels by 2030.
(Other studies have said the tax will have to be as high as $300 per tonne.)
In response to the PBO report, Mckenna said Trudeau's carbon tax would be frozen at $50 per tonne in 2022 and the government will use other means to achieve its targets.
Then she reversed course this week, telling the Globe and Mail it's possible the tax will be raised above
$50 per tonne in 2022, depending on consultations with the provinces.
She denied an allegation by the Conservatives that Trudeau has already decided to hike his carbon tax after 2022, which is not the same as saying it won't happen.
Her obfuscation, and
Trudeau's, is irresponsible.
What better time is there than an election campaign for Trudeau and Mckenna to come clean — pardon the pun — on their intentions for their carbon tax?
Premier Doug Ford's government announced Wednesday Ontario will appeal to the Supreme Court of Canada its earlier loss at the Ontario Court of Appeal, which found Trudeau's Greenhouse Gas Pollution Pricing Act is constitutional.
But in the real world, the fate of Trudeau's carbon tax will be decided in the Oct. 21 election.
If Trudeau is going to be honest with Canadians, he needs to explain now, not after the election, what his intentions are.
Alarmingly, as we have seen in scandals like Lavscam, honesty is not one of his strong suits.
Trudeau reelected equals RIP Canadian middle class.
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Gaon on August 30, 2019, 06:06:10 PM
Post by: Gaon on August 30, 2019, 06:06:10 PM
Trudeau must come clean on carbon taxes
It appears Prime Minister Justin Trudeau and Environment Minister Catherine Mckenna will be perfectly happy if Canadians have no idea where their carbon tax will be heading if the Liberals win the Oct. 21 election.
Mckenna's flip-flops over the past two months have been a case study in incoherency and confusion.
Prior to June, the government said its gradually increasing carbon tax, which will hit $50 per tonne of greenhouse gas emissions in 2022, would be reviewed at that time to see if it should be made more "stringent" (translation, "higher") going forward.
Then the Parliamentary Budget Office (PBO) released a report in mid-june saying Trudeau's carbon tax would need to be more than doubled to $102 per tonne by 2030, to meet Trudeau's commitment under the UN'S Paris climate accord to reduce Canada's emissions to 30% below 2005 levels by 2030.
(Other studies have said the tax will have to be as high as $300 per tonne.)
In response to the PBO report, Mckenna said Trudeau's carbon tax would be frozen at $50 per tonne in 2022 and the government will use other means to achieve its targets.
Then she reversed course this week, telling the Globe and Mail it's possible the tax will be raised above
$50 per tonne in 2022, depending on consultations with the provinces.
She denied an allegation by the Conservatives that Trudeau has already decided to hike his carbon tax after 2022, which is not the same as saying it won't happen.
Her obfuscation, and
Trudeau's, is irresponsible.
What better time is there than an election campaign for Trudeau and Mckenna to come clean — pardon the pun — on their intentions for their carbon tax?
Premier Doug Ford's government announced Wednesday Ontario will appeal to the Supreme Court of Canada its earlier loss at the Ontario Court of Appeal, which found Trudeau's Greenhouse Gas Pollution Pricing Act is constitutional.
But in the real world, the fate of Trudeau's carbon tax will be decided in the Oct. 21 election.
If Trudeau is going to be honest with Canadians, he needs to explain now, not after the election, what his intentions are.
Alarmingly, as we have seen in scandals like Lavscam, honesty is not one of his strong suits.
Wouldn't $300 per tonne trigger inflation?
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on August 30, 2019, 07:01:02 PM
Post by: Anonymous on August 30, 2019, 07:01:02 PM
Trudeau must come clean on carbon taxes
It appears Prime Minister Justin Trudeau and Environment Minister Catherine Mckenna will be perfectly happy if Canadians have no idea where their carbon tax will be heading if the Liberals win the Oct. 21 election.
Mckenna's flip-flops over the past two months have been a case study in incoherency and confusion.
Prior to June, the government said its gradually increasing carbon tax, which will hit $50 per tonne of greenhouse gas emissions in 2022, would be reviewed at that time to see if it should be made more "stringent" (translation, "higher") going forward.
Then the Parliamentary Budget Office (PBO) released a report in mid-june saying Trudeau's carbon tax would need to be more than doubled to $102 per tonne by 2030, to meet Trudeau's commitment under the UN'S Paris climate accord to reduce Canada's emissions to 30% below 2005 levels by 2030.
(Other studies have said the tax will have to be as high as $300 per tonne.)
In response to the PBO report, Mckenna said Trudeau's carbon tax would be frozen at $50 per tonne in 2022 and the government will use other means to achieve its targets.
Then she reversed course this week, telling the Globe and Mail it's possible the tax will be raised above
$50 per tonne in 2022, depending on consultations with the provinces.
She denied an allegation by the Conservatives that Trudeau has already decided to hike his carbon tax after 2022, which is not the same as saying it won't happen.
Her obfuscation, and
Trudeau's, is irresponsible.
What better time is there than an election campaign for Trudeau and Mckenna to come clean — pardon the pun — on their intentions for their carbon tax?
Premier Doug Ford's government announced Wednesday Ontario will appeal to the Supreme Court of Canada its earlier loss at the Ontario Court of Appeal, which found Trudeau's Greenhouse Gas Pollution Pricing Act is constitutional.
But in the real world, the fate of Trudeau's carbon tax will be decided in the Oct. 21 election.
If Trudeau is going to be honest with Canadians, he needs to explain now, not after the election, what his intentions are.
Alarmingly, as we have seen in scandals like Lavscam, honesty is not one of his strong suits.
Wouldn't $300 per tonne trigger inflation?
Don't worry, Trudeau will still be able to take his family on vacations to privately owned Caribbean islands owned by billionaires who receive our carbon tax revenue.
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on August 31, 2019, 04:36:47 PM
Post by: Anonymous on August 31, 2019, 04:36:47 PM
Trudeau must come clean on carbon taxes
It appears Prime Minister Justin Trudeau and Environment Minister Catherine Mckenna will be perfectly happy if Canadians have no idea where their carbon tax will be heading if the Liberals win the Oct. 21 election.
Mckenna's flip-flops over the past two months have been a case study in incoherency and confusion.
Prior to June, the government said its gradually increasing carbon tax, which will hit $50 per tonne of greenhouse gas emissions in 2022, would be reviewed at that time to see if it should be made more "stringent" (translation, "higher") going forward.
Then the Parliamentary Budget Office (PBO) released a report in mid-june saying Trudeau's carbon tax would need to be more than doubled to $102 per tonne by 2030, to meet Trudeau's commitment under the UN'S Paris climate accord to reduce Canada's emissions to 30% below 2005 levels by 2030.
(Other studies have said the tax will have to be as high as $300 per tonne.)
In response to the PBO report, Mckenna said Trudeau's carbon tax would be frozen at $50 per tonne in 2022 and the government will use other means to achieve its targets.
Then she reversed course this week, telling the Globe and Mail it's possible the tax will be raised above
$50 per tonne in 2022, depending on consultations with the provinces.
She denied an allegation by the Conservatives that Trudeau has already decided to hike his carbon tax after 2022, which is not the same as saying it won't happen.
Her obfuscation, and
Trudeau's, is irresponsible.
What better time is there than an election campaign for Trudeau and Mckenna to come clean — pardon the pun — on their intentions for their carbon tax?
Premier Doug Ford's government announced Wednesday Ontario will appeal to the Supreme Court of Canada its earlier loss at the Ontario Court of Appeal, which found Trudeau's Greenhouse Gas Pollution Pricing Act is constitutional.
But in the real world, the fate of Trudeau's carbon tax will be decided in the Oct. 21 election.
If Trudeau is going to be honest with Canadians, he needs to explain now, not after the election, what his intentions are.
Alarmingly, as we have seen in scandals like Lavscam, honesty is not one of his strong suits.
Wouldn't $300 per tonne trigger inflation?
It will trigger homelessness.
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: @realAzhyaAryola on September 08, 2019, 04:52:25 PM
Post by: @realAzhyaAryola on September 08, 2019, 04:52:25 PM
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on September 08, 2019, 10:59:06 PM
Post by: Anonymous on September 08, 2019, 10:59:06 PM
Waiting and watching what happens in your October elections...Quote from: "@realAzhyaAryola"
I am not. Justine will be reelected. The carbon tax goes up, income taxes go up, the deficit goes up, the resource sector along with jobs and wages go down.
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on September 09, 2019, 07:43:40 AM
Post by: Anonymous on September 09, 2019, 07:43:40 AM
Waiting and watching what happens in your October elections...Quote from: "@realAzhyaAryola"
I am not. Justine will be reelected. The carbon tax goes up, income taxes go up, the deficit goes up, the resource sector along with jobs and wages go down.
Trudeau is a serial ethics violator and he not only has not resigned, he's going to be reelected.
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on September 13, 2019, 12:57:53 AM
Post by: Anonymous on September 13, 2019, 12:57:53 AM
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on October 12, 2019, 01:02:10 AM
Post by: Anonymous on October 12, 2019, 01:02:10 AM
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on October 18, 2019, 07:32:49 AM
Post by: Anonymous on October 18, 2019, 07:32:49 AM
The Conservatives can't do it without a majority.
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on October 18, 2019, 11:59:58 AM
Post by: Anonymous on October 18, 2019, 11:59:58 AM
There is no chance now of our always increasing carbon tax being repealed..Quote from: "Fashionista"
:sad:
The Conservatives can't do it without a majority.
I don't like the Conservative party, but I like plank in their platform. Carbon taxes are working people subsidizing billionaires and big companies.
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on October 18, 2019, 07:04:49 PM
Post by: Anonymous on October 18, 2019, 07:04:49 PM
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Gaon on October 19, 2019, 12:06:43 AM
Post by: Gaon on October 19, 2019, 12:06:43 AM
And it's big companies that benefit from carbon taxes.Quote from: "Fashionista"
Would you support carbon taxes if it was offset by lower income taxes and sales tax?
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on October 19, 2019, 12:16:27 AM
Post by: Anonymous on October 19, 2019, 12:16:27 AM
And it's big companies that benefit from carbon taxes.Quote from: "Fashionista"
Would you support carbon taxes if it was offset by lower income taxes and sales tax?
I guess in theory I might, but that would never happen in Canada.
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Gaon on October 19, 2019, 12:30:58 AM
Post by: Gaon on October 19, 2019, 12:30:58 AM
And it's big companies that benefit from carbon taxes.Quote from: "Fashionista"
Would you support carbon taxes if it was offset by lower income taxes and sales tax?
That is how economists that support the idea of taxing carbon said it should work.
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on October 19, 2019, 07:59:30 AM
Post by: Anonymous on October 19, 2019, 07:59:30 AM
And it's big companies that benefit from carbon taxes.Quote from: "Fashionista"
Would you support carbon taxes if it was offset by lower income taxes and sales tax?
My province brought in a cap and trade scheme along with quickly mothballing coal plants and subsidizing useless wind and solar schemes with raising gasoline and home heating taxes. The result was forcing hundreds of thousands of low income Ontarians into fuel poverty along with corruption and the highest sub sovereign debt in the world. Forced transitions do not work. The only thing they force is poor people deciding to get to work or heat their home.
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Thiel on October 20, 2019, 12:10:01 AM
Post by: Thiel on October 20, 2019, 12:10:01 AM
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on October 20, 2019, 10:51:01 AM
Post by: Anonymous on October 20, 2019, 10:51:01 AM
If anyone is still undecided, this may help you make a choice between the two main parties.Quote from: "Thiel"https://www.facebook.com/cpcpcc/videos/471674956891523/
If anyone is undecided at this point, this aint likely to make a difference.
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on November 11, 2019, 01:10:31 AM
Post by: Anonymous on November 11, 2019, 01:10:31 AM
By Lorne Gunter or Sun News Media
Justin Trudeau and the Liberals love them but buying carbon offsets is futile
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on November 11, 2019, 02:09:23 AM
Post by: Anonymous on November 11, 2019, 02:09:23 AM
'Revenue neutral' carbon tax is not an accounting exercise for B.C. families. It's an expensive reality
While Prime Minister Justin Trudeau's government gets set to force a federal carbon tax on all of Canada's provinces and territories, taxpayers across the country deserve to know what happened in the country's carbon-tax test case, British Columbia.
The Trojan horse of the carbon tax was wheeled into the B.C. public square in 2008 with the government's promise that it would somehow cost average people nothing and would be "revenue neutral." But, that turned out to be a cautionary tale for the ages.
For years, the carbon-tax cheerleaders continued to laud the fee that's been tacked on to carbon-emitting goods and services, urging the rest of the country to follow suit. It was touted as a magical formula that would somehow protect the environment and lower taxes all at once. Visions of hydrogen-powered buses and solar cars danced in the heads of the green bean counters. "Revenue neutral" they all sang.
The reality of government, however, is always duller and grift-ier than that. The current B.C. government has dropped the term "revenue neutral" altogether and now calls the carbon tax a "tool."
Before the charade was abandoned entirely, this is what "revenue neutral" meant for the B.C. carbon tax: In 2016–17 the provincial government raked in $1.2 billion in the carbon tax from taxpayers. The amount is listed on page 68 in the budget document as a frame entitled: "Revenue Neutral Carbon Tax Plan." Then, the government scraped together 17 sundry tax credits and stuffed them into the carbon-tax frame, making the tax sum balance out to zero. Abracadabra: "revenue neutral." That's all it meant.
It was a crass puppet show. Every provincial and federal budget includes tax credits for things like home renovations, children's fitness programs, film incentives, and business training tax credits. In B.C., however, there is an uncommon carbon tax taken from people, so these very common credits were just repackaged to make the tax appear neutral on paper. As a senior B.C. government official admitted during last year's budget lockup, "this was always just an accounting exercise."
The carbon tax is not an accounting exercise for B.C. families. It's an expensive reality for any Canadian subjected to it.
To fill up an average Toyota Camry with a 70-litre fuel tank costs $6 in carbon tax
Under the federal formula at $35 per tonne, the carbon tax costs a lot of money at the gas station, approximately 8.55 cents per litre of gasoline with the GST tacked onto it, and 10.06 cents per litre for diesel with the GST. To fill up an average Toyota Camry with a 70-litre fuel tank costs $6 in carbon tax. A Dodge Ram pick-up truck costs more than $10 in carbon tax and a Ford Super Duty Diesel costs more than $17 per fill up. For tractor-trailer trucks, it costs $45 in carbon taxes to fill up just one of those cylinder tanks with diesel. Canadians bought more than 40 billion litres of gasoline and more than 16 billion litres of diesel fuel in 2016. Multiply that volume by the carbon tax per litre and the government haul is crystal clear.
It gets worse, though, because even with the carbon tax costing Canadians billions of dollars, it's still not reducing emissions, according to environmentalists leading the carbon-tax charge. In January, the Sierra Club reported on the B.C. experiment: "emissions were higher in 2015 than in 2010 and have risen in four of the last five years. B.C.'s latest emissions data mark years of failure to reduce emissions by more than a token amount." If taking billions of dollars away from Canadians doesn't reduce emissions, then, what is the point of this forced carbon tax?
If taking billions of dollars away from Canadians doesn't reduce emissions, then, what is the point of this forced carbon tax?
When the forced federal carbon tax is set at $50 per tonne in 2022, that means that gasoline will have a carbon tax of 11.63 cents per litre. Will that be enough? Not according to the Environment Canada bureaucrats who told Environment Minister Catherine McKenna that the country needs a carbon tax of $100 per tonne by 2020 and a tax of $300 per tonne by 2050 to meet the government's promises under the Paris climate agreement. That would be 23 cents per litre on gas in 2020 and then 70 cents per litre by 2050 — about $50 extra in today's money to fill up the family sedan.
People need to use oil and gas. The carbon tax doesn't make people "reduce their use" of this modern lifeblood, it just costs them a lot of money while not stopping the emissions. Our economy and our modern way of life depend on oil and gas. We use them to run our power stations, till our soil, plant our food, mine our minerals, mill our wood, heat our greenhouses, manufacture all of our goods and haul those goods and food to market.
We use oil and gas products to travel to school, work and the beach. Planes, automobiles and transit buses all use oil and gas, and they were manufactured and shipped to us using oil and gas. All of these actions of everyday life depend upon the miracle of hydrocarbons, so, the carbon tax is a tax on everything.
Carbon taxes don't just make gasoline more expensive, they make life much more expensive.
Carbon taxes in North America are not revenue neutral. At least governments are starting to be honest about that fact.
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on November 14, 2019, 01:15:04 PM
Post by: Anonymous on November 14, 2019, 01:15:04 PM
The Department of Finance cited a study published in the Canadian Journal Of Agricultural Economics looking at the implementation of the carbon tax in British Columbia that "found no evidence that the carbon tax is associated with any meaningful effect on agricultural trade."
However, emails reveal Department of Agriculture
staff claim: "The fact sheet says the paper found 'no evidence' when in fact the paper claims it found 'little evidence'. That's an important distinction, and I think misquoting the paper undermines the argument."
When a Department of Agriculture manager found out about the mistake they sent a message to colleagues that read, "I hadn't checked that but you're right. That's a doozy!"
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on November 14, 2019, 03:55:37 PM
Post by: Anonymous on November 14, 2019, 03:55:37 PM
Uh oh, a fib was told by the carbon tax advocates.Quote from: "seoulbro"
The Department of Finance cited a study published in the Canadian Journal Of Agricultural Economics looking at the implementation of the carbon tax in British Columbia that "found no evidence that the carbon tax is associated with any meaningful effect on agricultural trade."
However, emails reveal Department of Agriculture
staff claim: "The fact sheet says the paper found 'no evidence' when in fact the paper claims it found 'little evidence'. That's an important distinction, and I think misquoting the paper undermines the argument."
When a Department of Agriculture manager found out about the mistake they sent a message to colleagues that read, "I hadn't checked that but you're right. That's a doozy!"
There has been a few fibs pro carbon taxers have told about BC's carbon tax.
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on November 14, 2019, 04:52:01 PM
Post by: Anonymous on November 14, 2019, 04:52:01 PM
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on November 14, 2019, 05:59:47 PM
Post by: Anonymous on November 14, 2019, 05:59:47 PM
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on November 14, 2019, 09:21:18 PM
Post by: Anonymous on November 14, 2019, 09:21:18 PM
Title: Re: Green Party and Trudeau defence of carbon taxes debunked
Post by: Anonymous on November 24, 2019, 03:39:09 AM
Post by: Anonymous on November 24, 2019, 03:39:09 AM