The Horrendous Death rate of Covid Patients on Ventilators Sparks Doctors to Question Use
https://time.com/5820556/ventilators-covid-19/
More Doctors daily are supporting the concept that
(Survival rate on ventilators is considerably less than for pneumonia patients > for whom they were actually designed for)
New York City emergency-medicine physician Dr. Cameron Kyle-Sidell sparked controversy when, two weeks ago, he posted a YouTube video claiming that ventilators may be harming COVID-19 patients more than they're helping.
"
Weeks later, claims from Kyle-Sidell and like-minded doctors continue to spark impassioned debate within the medical community, with some doctors moving away from the use of ventilators and others defending the current standard of care. What's clear, though, is COVID-19 patients on ventilators aren't doing as well as doctors would hope—and health care experts are scrambling to fix it.
He says some doctors are intubating early because they fear that less-intensive forms of ventilation, like high-flow nasal oxygen, can aerosolize a virus, putting health care workers at risk of getting sick. "This is more theoretical fear than a real fear," Hill says, since there's not strong evidence that COVID-19 spreads this way.
If it is proven that ventilators caused death, than there will be lawsuits. It is America we are talking about.
Further > Then there's the issue of how to treat patients who do end up on ventilators. Tufts' Hill agrees that COVID-19 patients do not behave exactly like they have ARDS, a type of respiratory distress that occurs when fluid builds up in the lungs' air sacs. The lungs usually get stiff when a patient has ARDS, requiring high-pressure ventilation to support them. But that's not happening with many COVID-19 patients, Hill says, leading some doctors to fear that the extra pressure is actually damaging the lungs.
Even stranger, some COVID-19 patients who show very low blood oxygen levels still appear to be breathing fairly comfortably, raising even more questions about how much support they need.
Many docs and hospitals are now going to oxygen via mask of nose
So, hospitals could be responsible for thousands of deaths.
Inadvertently, yes. However, this is new =
- We are where we are
If I was in that position I would insist on oxygen (initially by mask) and refuse vents
It'a all kind of close to me - In early February, when I was in for pneumonia (very severe .. thought I might be dying) .. the week before this all started in Canada
I found oxygen did wonders ... my blood oxygen came up quickly and all was well ... home in 5 days .. and that was with severe pneumonia and thus included lung damage
So I recently experienced what oxygen alone can do to a very severely lung-ill person
Actually, I used it by nose after an hour or so on mask ... not near as efficient as by mask, but blood oxygen count came up fast and I felt human again in short order
Quote from: "cc"
https://time.com/5820556/ventilators-covid-19/
More Doctors daily are supporting the concept that
(Survival rate on ventilators is considerably less than for pneumonia patients > for whom they were actually designed for)
New York City emergency-medicine physician Dr. Cameron Kyle-Sidell sparked controversy when, two weeks ago, he posted a YouTube video claiming that ventilators may be harming COVID-19 patients more than they're helping.
"
Weeks later, claims from Kyle-Sidell and like-minded doctors continue to spark impassioned debate within the medical community, with some doctors moving away from the use of ventilators and others defending the current standard of care. What's clear, though, is COVID-19 patients on ventilators aren't doing as well as doctors would hope—and health care experts are scrambling to fix it.
He says some doctors are intubating early because they fear that less-intensive forms of ventilation, like high-flow nasal oxygen, can aerosolize a virus, putting health care workers at risk of getting sick. "This is more theoretical fear than a real fear," Hill says, since there's not strong evidence that COVID-19 spreads this way.
Jesus H. :2r4ml1j_th:
Quote from: "cc"
- We are where we are
If I was in that position I would insist on oxygen (initially by mask) and refuse vents
It'a all kind of close to me - In early February, when I was in for pneumonia (very severe .. thought I might be dying) .. the week before this all started in Canada
I found oxygen did wonders ... my blood oxygen came up quickly and all was well ... home in 5 days .. and that was with severe pneumonia and thus included lung damage
So I recently experienced what oxygen alone can do to a very severely lung-ill person
Actually, I used it by nose after an hour or so on mask ... not near as efficient as by mask, but blood oxygen count came up fast and I felt human again in short order
Sorry to hear that kid. My older sister had pneumonia about twelve years ago. She says when she catches a cold now it feels worse than it did pre pneumonia.
I'm OK now .. strength pretty much back to normal .. don't feel any effects now
But, having very recently had pneumonia makes me extra cautious of the virus .. as lungs always weaken for quite a while with it .. medical people say it take 3 + months minimum to get back to normal
Close to paranoid would be more accurate and honest - I protect myself to the hilt from others
Quote from: "cc"
But, having just had pneumonia makes me extra cautious of the virus .. as lungs always weaken for quite a while with it
Close to paranoid would be more accurate and honest - I protect myself to the hilt from others
I don't frickin blame ya. You should isolate on my farm. I have plenty of barrel wash. :icon_wink:
ac_biggrin
Don't do it cc, he'll make you shine his shitters.
Quote from: "cc"
But, having very recently had pneumonia makes me extra cautious of the virus .. as lungs always weaken for quite a while with it .. medical people say it take 3 + months minimum to get back to normal
Close to paranoid would be more accurate and honest - I protect myself to the hilt from others
You cannot be too careful.
Quote from: "Shen Li"
He'd live to regret that
On second thot, he might not .................. live that is ac_biggrin
Quote from: "seoulbro"
Quote from: "cc"
But, having very recently had pneumonia makes me extra cautious of the virus .. as lungs always weaken for quite a while with it .. medical people say it take 3 + months minimum to get back to normal
Close to paranoid would be more accurate and honest - I protect myself to the hilt from others
You cannot be too careful.
Agree. I certainly make no apologies for being extra cautious. Problem for those who have not had it is "time" ... it could be a long time before things are safe
Actually, I guess they have not proved immunity for those who have had it ... I'm sure you will be watching for proof in that area
Quote from: "cc"
Quote from: "seoulbro"
Quote from: "cc"
But, having very recently had pneumonia makes me extra cautious of the virus .. as lungs always weaken for quite a while with it .. medical people say it take 3 + months minimum to get back to normal
Close to paranoid would be more accurate and honest - I protect myself to the hilt from others
You cannot be too careful.
Agree. I certainly make no apologies for being extra cautious. Problem for those who have not had it is "time" ... it could be a long time before things are safe
Actually, I guess they have not proved immunity for those who have had it ... I'm sure you will be watching for proof in that area
Nor should you. You are still recovering from one respiratory illness. You do not want another one.