The ladies I work with were discussing the Charlie Hebdo cartoons today when it turned to the subject of Canada's blasphemy laws..
I was unaware Canada had a law about blasphemy..
Is this true and what does it mean for free speech, criticism and satire?
You seem to know a lot about legal matters, so I thought you would be someone I should ask
Thank you
ac_smile
Hey Fash. Thanks for thinking of me.
In Canada, we have a section in our Criminal code for "blasphemous libel". The last case brought before Canadian Courts was in the mid 1930s meaning it's rarely applied these days. Hate speech laws cover this subject better in our time. The test with blasphemous libel is that it must be intended to insult the feelings and convictions of the majority of people.
Criticism is a part of "fair comment" in most cases and satire is meant for humour, not insult. Both are protected under section 2 of the Canadian Charter (free speech line).
Quote from: "Real Woman"
In Canada, we have a section in our Criminal code for "blasphemous libel". The last case brought before Canadian Courts was in the mid 1930s meaning it's rarely applied these days. Hate speech laws cover this subject better in our time. The test with blasphemous libel is that it must be intended to insult the feelings and convictions of the majority of people.
Criticism is a part of "fair comment" in most cases and satire is meant for humour, not insult. Both are protected under section 2 of the Canadian Charter (free speech line).
Thank you very much Real Woman..
ac_smile
There was some misunderstanding among the ladies I work with about how far criticism of religion in general and Islam specifically could go.
Against xianity, Hinduism, Jewish etc. etc. there is no limit as to how far it goes (see most of Charly's toons for example), ... no pushback and very little static
The begged and too obvious next sentence need not even be said
Quote from: "cc li tarte"
The next and too obvious sentence need not be said
Maybe because people that are critical of them get to keep their heads. That and we don't have OPEC billions funding international Buddhist jihadists.
Actually it's the wannabe supremacist thingy + Mo ordered no making fun of him or allah and followers actually take their orders seriously
Quote from: "cc li tarte"
It's cowardice and capitulation on our part. I agree with you, their greatest strength is our collective weakness.
It sure is ... cue the usual peons
Quote from: "cc li tarte"
Sir Lance troll a lot, where art thou?
Quote from: "Fashionista"
Quote from: "Real Woman"
In Canada, we have a section in our Criminal code for "blasphemous libel". The last case brought before Canadian Courts was in the mid 1930s meaning it's rarely applied these days. Hate speech laws cover this subject better in our time. The test with blasphemous libel is that it must be intended to insult the feelings and convictions of the majority of people.
Criticism is a part of "fair comment" in most cases and satire is meant for humour, not insult. Both are protected under section 2 of the Canadian Charter (free speech line).
Thank you very much Real Woman..
ac_smile
There was some misunderstanding among the ladies I work with about how far criticism of religion in general and Islam specifically could go.
You can criticize any group as long as you don't incite hatred or hold the group up to riducule and contempt.
What public interest does it serve to make fun of Mohammed? That's the test.
[size=200]Haw Soooooo![/size]
Quote from: "Real Woman"
Quote from: "Fashionista"
Quote from: "Real Woman"
In Canada, we have a section in our Criminal code for "blasphemous libel". The last case brought before Canadian Courts was in the mid 1930s meaning it's rarely applied these days. Hate speech laws cover this subject better in our time. The test with blasphemous libel is that it must be intended to insult the feelings and convictions of the majority of people.
Criticism is a part of "fair comment" in most cases and satire is meant for humour, not insult. Both are protected under section 2 of the Canadian Charter (free speech line).
Thank you very much Real Woman..
ac_smile
There was some misunderstanding among the ladies I work with about how far criticism of religion in general and Islam specifically could go.
You can criticize any group as long as you don't incite hatred or hold the group up to riducule and contempt.
Now I am confused again..
What and who defines what is ridicule and contempt?
Quote from: "Asian Pride"
[size=200]Haw Soooooo![/size]
Hello Asian Pride, it's so nice to see you again.
ac_smile
Nín hǎo
Quote from: "Asian Pride"
Wo hen hao, xiexie.
ac_smile
Quote from: "Real Woman"
No one ever asked "What public interest does it serve to make fun of an other religious person? "
It just never came up, eh?
Quote from: "cc li tarte"
Quote from: "Real Woman"
No one ever asked "What public interest does it serve to make fun of an other religious person? "
It just never came up, eh?
I would assume people that think Islam is a threat to the good of society would think it serves a purpose.
Quote from: "cc li tarte"
Quote from: "Real Woman"
No one ever asked "What public interest does it serve to make fun of an other religious person? "
It just never came up, eh?
It has come up in terms of cases of satire.
I'm just wondering if you have an answer for Islam.
Quote from: "Fashionista"
What and who defines what is ridicule and contempt?
The law does as well as the courts. You'll also see cases in Human Rights Tribunals.
Here are some legal definitions:
Contempt suggests looking down upon or treating as inferior the object of one's feelings.
The Code defines genocide as the destruction of an "identifiable group." The Code defines an "identifiable group" as "any section of the public distinguished by colour, race, religion, ethnic origin or sexual orientation."
Here's what it doesn't cover:
I need to take back ridicule as the Supreme court removed "
Quote from: "Real Woman"
Quote from: "Fashionista"
What and who defines what is ridicule and contempt?
The law does as well as the courts. You'll also see cases in Human Rights Tribunals.
Here are some legal definitions:
Contempt suggests looking down upon or treating as inferior the object of one's feelings.
The Code defines genocide as the destruction of an "identifiable group." The Code defines an "identifiable group" as "any section of the public distinguished by colour, race, religion, ethnic origin or sexual orientation."
Here's what it doesn't cover:
I need to take back ridicule as the Supreme court removed "
That makes it a little clearer, especially part b..
I'll save this in case the subject comes up again today during lunch..
Thanks again Real Woman and have a nice day.
ac_smile
NP Fash :) You too!
Quote from: "cc li tarte"
The begged and too obvious next sentence need not even be said
I don't think freedom of speech laws were written to give Islamophobes like you a podium to hate.
I don't think hate laws were designed to stifle people from speaking out about the atrocities of religious terrorism either.
Quote from: "Real Woman"
Yeah, well how about attention whoring? If it isn't, it fucking well should be.
Quote from: "Lance Leftardashian"
Quote from: "cc li tarte"
The begged and too obvious next sentence need not even be said
I don't think freedom of speech laws were written to give Islamophobes like you a podium to hate.
OK Troll. I'm calling you.
Are you upset about the spoofs on actual religions? .. or are you selectively and only upset about comparably softer spoofs on a supremacist ideology? .... keeping in mind that most of Charly's spoofs were about REAL religions and not about islam
Quote from: "cc li tarte"
Quote from: "Lance Leftardashian"
Quote from: "cc li tarte"
The begged and too obvious next sentence need not even be said
I don't think freedom of speech laws were written to give Islamophobes like you a podium to hate.
OK Troll. I'm calling you.
Are you upset about the spoofs on actual religions? .. or are you selectively upset about comparably softer spoofs on a supremacist ideology?
I am upset with the cancer of Islamophobia. I'm upset that something like cartoons are being used as a tool to ferment hatred.
That was fast - Do you live here?
Gutless to answer the straightforward honest question about ACTUAL religions - figured that
Quote from: "cc li tarte"
You know that one trick pony trolls can't answer honest questions. Going off script is not allowed. ac_biggrin
Quote from: "cc li tarte"
Gutless to answer the straightforward honest question about ACTUAL religions - figured that
Islam is an actual religion. If you want to call it something else to make your hatred of Muslims easier to swallow, that makes you exactly like every other Islamophobe.
Quote from: "Lance Leftardashian"
Quote from: "cc li tarte"
Gutless to answer the straightforward honest question about ACTUAL religions - figured that
Islam is an actual religion. If you want to call it something else to make your hatred of Muslims easier to swallow, that makes you exactly like every other Islamophobe.
Listen asshole, CC knows 10 times more about Islam and it's aims than you do about being an attention whore.
Go fuck urself with a splintered broom handle. acc_angry
Quote from: "cc li tarte"
The begged and too obvious next sentence need not even be said
It's racist to tell the truth anymore, didn't you know that ac_lmfao
Islamist I here is a new sub species of human, ones that love chanting at the moon like some crabs do. ac_toofunny
You know though, it's alright for them to quote their hate speech, but when you quote the same from their book you're a racist.
So is the race a book now, or to a mentally challenged lot of hateful humans ???
Quote from: "Blue"
Quote from: "cc li tarte"
The begged and too obvious next sentence need not even be said
It's racist to tell the truth anymore, didn't you know that ac_lmfao
Islamist I here is a new sub species of human, ones that love chanting at the moon like some crabs do. ac_toofunny
You know though, it's alright for them to quote their hate speech, but when you quote the same from their book you're a racist.
So is the race a book now, or to a mentally challenged lot of hateful humans ???
It's racist when trolls think it will piss people off.
Yeah I know it, poor little trolls.
I like a good troll, haven't seen any good ones in a long time though. ac_natch
Quote from: "Blue"
I like a good troll, haven't seen any good ones in a long time though. ac_natch
I miss instigator. That guy was born to troll. ac_king
I should go back to trolling, I was pretty successful trolling trolls.
might do that sometime in the future on one of the forums again.
Quote from: "Blue"
might do that sometime in the future on one of the forums again.
You should use your creative juices to come up with a handle to troll the troll Lance.
I made a point to troll the hateful ones on the old DV, and ones attacking others.
It was hard for me to stand by watching good people attacked, and hurting from the silly stuff.
Quote from: "Blue"
It was hard for me to stand by watching good people attacked, and hurting from the silly stuff.
I joined it shortly before it went tits up, so I can't remember much about it. I do remember how busy it was. Vancouver Forum used to be pretty good a few years ago too. It's circling the bowl big time now though.
The last year maybe two it went way down, very bad trolling, and the gay bar style posting by a few.
I really think the mods, and owner gave up on it letting it come to that.
There was a lot of great people on there, i miss them a lot.
Quote from: "Blue"
I really think the mods, and owner gave up on it letting it come to that.
There was a lot of great people on there, i miss them a lot.
Are you talking about VF or DV?
DV, it went down fast, and people left for VF, and other forums.
The mods at DV were iron fists until the end. It wasn't until the outages that DV really drained.
Quote from: "Blue"
So, you meant DV when you posted this?
Quote
I really think the mods, and owner gave up on it letting it come to that.
There was a lot of great people on there, i miss them a lot.
Quote from: "Real Woman"
I thought DV was pretty much welcome to the jungle? However, like I said, I registered near the end of it.
I think for some things they where hard on people, but others like the personal attacks not so much.
Also the spamming with gay threads didn't help, usually by one person.
I think the real turning point for DV was the crap with M happened, it was a bit much for most people to hang in there.
Quote from: "Blue"
Also the spamming with gay threads didn't help, usually by one person.
I think the real turning point for DV was the crap with M happened, it was a bit much for most people to hang in there.
OK, so you meant DV. Who was M?
Quote from: "Shen Li"
Quote from: "Blue"
So, you meant DV when you posted this?
Quote
I really think the mods, and owner gave up on it letting it come to that.
There was a lot of great people on there, i miss them a lot.
Yeah DV.
If some people remember I was on almost 24/7 for a long time. I saw a lot, and even was accused of owning the place.
Quote from: "Shen Li"
Quote from: "Blue"
Also the spamming with gay threads didn't help, usually by one person.
I think the real turning point for DV was the crap with M happened, it was a bit much for most people to hang in there.
OK, so you meant DV. Who was M?
She was a very smart person, but couldn't let things go, and went nuts.
Seemed like every thread was her arguing with people, and mostly trolls fighting it out.
Nobody wants that.
I remember hearing about that but I wasn't around for it.
You didn't miss anything, people just got quiet except for them arguing.
I tried breaking it up, but in my opinion they all needed banned.
there was I think four posters maybe killing the forum, M included not letting the stuff go.
Quote from: "Blue"
I tried breaking it up, but in my opinion they all needed banned.
there was I think four posters maybe killing the forum, M included not letting the stuff go.
Oh wait a minute here....I remember Gordy talking about a Meg or Meggs. She was a drama queen apparently.
Quote from: "Shen Li"
Quote from: "Blue"
I tried breaking it up, but in my opinion they all needed banned.
there was I think four posters maybe killing the forum, M included not letting the stuff go.
Oh wait a minute here....I remember Gordy talking about a Meg or Meggs. She was a drama queen apparently.
I think she had a mental issue, and people attacked her when they found out she was bothered by stuff.
Someone posted some of her personal info, and maybe her address or something, she went nuts.
I think police was called, lawyers, and other crap like that.
Gordy, David, and a few others wouldn't stop attacking her, and that's all the forum was about for like 6 months.
Quote from: "Blue"
Quote from: "Shen Li"
Quote from: "Blue"
I tried breaking it up, but in my opinion they all needed banned.
there was I think four posters maybe killing the forum, M included not letting the stuff go.
Oh wait a minute here....I remember Gordy talking about a Meg or Meggs. She was a drama queen apparently.
I think she had a mental issue, and people attacked her when they found out she was bothered by stuff.
Someone posted some of her personal info, and maybe her address or something, she went nuts.
I think police was called, lawyers, and other crap like that.
Gordy, David, and a few others wouldn't stop attacking her, and that's all the forum was about for like 6 months.
That sounds like Gordy for sure. He's like a shark that sees blood.
I heard it was Gordy who posted her PI.
He was one of the top ones attacking her, I forget the other two who did , but they wouldn't stop.
Thread after thread nothing but them, or them following her into them.
LOL, she blamed me for letting them do it ac_dunno what could I do, I told her ignore them, and tried stepping in for a while.
Quote from: "Real Woman"
Yeah, he would do that. I remember Gordy mentioning her a lot on VF. I wish someone archived DV. I would love to see some of that stuff. It sounds really entertaining.
Quote from: "Real Woman"
I think it was him, or that one troll on there, Ben or Ban Palagory was in on it also.
Quote from: "Shen Li"
Quote from: "Real Woman"
Yeah, he would do that. I remember Gordy mentioning her a lot on VF. I wish someone archived DV. I would love to see some of that stuff. It sounds really entertaining.
It had it's times when it was really fun, but that ran off some good people.
Quote from: "Blue"
Quote from: "Shen Li"
Quote from: "Real Woman"
Yeah, he would do that. I remember Gordy mentioning her a lot on VF. I wish someone archived DV. I would love to see some of that stuff. It sounds really entertaining.
It had it's times when it was really fun, but that ran off some good people.
It sounded lively.
It was most the time, lots of different threads going at ones, fights in some, but nothing lasting usually.
We had an area just for fighting for a while, the wild west lol
Quote from: "Blue"
We had an area just for fighting for a while, the wild west lol
Hello Blue, I am so happy to see you here today.
ac_smile
I remember the wild west. hahah
I remember pre-registration too.
Hello sweet person :) good seeing you also.
I gotta go soon though.
Hope you are well, and happy Fashion lady.
Quote from: "Real Woman"
I remember pre-registration too.
Pre registration was fun also, a little hard keeping a handle though for the trolls.
The Wild west i loved it there, fun to here the trolls crying about the registered people. ac_dance
Quote from: "Blue"
I gotta go soon though.
Hope you are well, and happy Fashion lady.
Hey stud, are you going to be around your own forum later tonight. If you are, I will drop by. Put some chicken on for me. :howdy:
Quote from: "Shen Li"
Quote from: "Blue"
I gotta go soon though.
Hope you are well, and happy Fashion lady.
Hey stud, are you going to be around your own forum later tonight. If you are, I will drop by. Put some chicken on for me. :howdy:
Ill be there in a while, gotta do some stuff first though, and clean up some :) fresh frosty is the best frosty. ac_biggrin
Quote from: "Blue"
Quote from: "Shen Li"
Quote from: "Blue"
I gotta go soon though.
Hope you are well, and happy Fashion lady.
Hey stud, are you going to be around your own forum later tonight. If you are, I will drop by. Put some chicken on for me. :howdy:
Ill be there in a while, gotta do some stuff first though, and clean up some :) fresh frosty is the best frosty. ac_biggrin
I like you fresh or not..
Goodbye Blue and I hope to see you again soon.
ac_smile
Quote from: "Real Woman"
Canada's blasphemy laws came up today again at lunch..
I checked my phone and read what you posted and one of the ladies I work with asked me jokingly if I consulted a lawyer..
I replied in fun, yes, but she did it pro bono.
ac_biggrin
hahahahaa that's too cute Fash. I've only take a few law courses in my day but I love law. :)
Quote from: "Real Woman"
I thought so.