THeBlueCashew

Quote from: "RW"It would be cool, IMHO, to have a thread or section where you have a couple posts each to present an argument and folks vote like a jury.  



Am I too legally nerdy or could this be fun?

Quote from: "RW"It would be cool, IMHO, to have a thread or section where you have a couple posts each to present an argument and folks vote like a jury.  



Am I too legally nerdy or could this be fun?

Quote from: "RW"It would be cool, IMHO, to have a thread or section where you have a couple posts each to present an argument and folks vote like a jury.  



Am I too legally nerdy or could this be fun?

Quote from: "RW"It would be cool, IMHO, to have a thread or section where you have a couple posts each to present an argument and folks vote like a jury.  



Am I too legally nerdy or could this be fun?

Quote from: "RW"Yes but it would be interesting to see how the "jury" feels on a very specific issue.

Quote from: "Frost"Do we vote the looser off the island in a cardboard box ?  ac_toofunny

Quote from: "Frost"Well being a court someone needs punishment.

Shen, how about if you get to punish them, would that be good  ac_biggrin

Quote from: "Frost"My guess most of us might not turn any down. Don't spoil Keeper with it. ac_toofunny

Quote from: "RW"It would be cool, IMHO, to have a thread or section where you have a couple posts each to present an argument and folks vote like a jury.  



Am I too legally nerdy or could this be fun?

Quote from: "easter bunny"

Quote from: "RW"It would be cool, IMHO, to have a thread or section where you have a couple posts each to present an argument and folks vote like a jury.  



Am I too legally nerdy or could this be fun?

Legal nerdiness is good. How about a topic?

Quote from: "Fashionista"

Quote from: "easter bunny"

Quote from: "RW"It would be cool, IMHO, to have a thread or section where you have a couple posts each to present an argument and folks vote like a jury.  



Am I too legally nerdy or could this be fun?

Legal nerdiness is good. How about a topic?

Since it is the day some people celebrate marijuana usage, may I suggest legalization?

Quote from: "easter bunny"

Quote from: "Fashionista"

Quote from: "easter bunny"
Legal nerdiness is good. How about a topic?

Since it is the day some people celebrate marijuana usage, may I suggest legalization?

I've always believed that the more you tell rebellious kids that something is forbidden the more they will want to do it, so when it comes to drugs I favor legalization along with education.

Quote from: "easter bunny"I think drug and alcohol abuse are just symptoms of a much bigger problem. We need to focus on the cause more. The symptoms will take care of themselves.

Quote from: "Fashionista"

Quote from: "easter bunny"I think drug and alcohol abuse are just symptoms of a much bigger problem. We need to focus on the cause more. The symptoms will take care of themselves.

I have met people in my church that have taken drugs or abused alcohol in their lives..



Most of the ones that we have talked to said any other problems took care of themselves when they stopped drinking and substance abuse.

 ac_dunno

Quote from: "RW"So what I was thinking is the presentation of a scenario.  Two people debate the issue and after say 3 posts, we decide which argument is the most compelling.  I will provide a scenario for consideration (it doesn't have to be real):



You die.  You are reincarnated as a newborn child but you have retained all of your memories and knowledge from your previous (current) life.  In your life, you had a husband and kids, friends, family.



Do you:



a) Stay with your new family and start a new life from scratch reaping all the benefits of your existing knowledge



or



b) Seek out your spouse, children and family, explain what has happened and try to be a part of your previous life



Who wants to argue a and who wants to argue b?

Quote from: "RW"So what I was thinking is the presentation of a scenario.  Two people debate the issue and after say 3 posts, we decide which argument is the most compelling.  I will provide a scenario for consideration (it doesn't have to be real):



You die.  You are reincarnated as a newborn child but you have retained all of your memories and knowledge from your previous (current) life.  In your life, you had a husband and kids, friends, family.



Do you:



a) Stay with your new family and start a new life from scratch reaping all the benefits of your existing knowledge



or



b) Seek out your spouse, children and family, explain what has happened and try to be a part of your previous life



Who wants to argue a and who wants to argue b?

Quote from: "Fashionista"

Quote from: "RW"So what I was thinking is the presentation of a scenario.  Two people debate the issue and after say 3 posts, we decide which argument is the most compelling.  I will provide a scenario for consideration (it doesn't have to be real):



You die.  You are reincarnated as a newborn child but you have retained all of your memories and knowledge from your previous (current) life.  In your life, you had a husband and kids, friends, family.



Do you:



a) Stay with your new family and start a new life from scratch reaping all the benefits of your existing knowledge



or



b) Seek out your spouse, children and family, explain what has happened and try to be a part of your previous life



Who wants to argue a and who wants to argue b?

Since I do not believe in reincarnation, I cannot argue for either side RW.

Quote from: "RW"

Quote from: "Fashionista"

Quote from: "RW"So what I was thinking is the presentation of a scenario.  Two people debate the issue and after say 3 posts, we decide which argument is the most compelling.  I will provide a scenario for consideration (it doesn't have to be real):



You die.  You are reincarnated as a newborn child but you have retained all of your memories and knowledge from your previous (current) life.  In your life, you had a husband and kids, friends, family.



Do you:



a) Stay with your new family and start a new life from scratch reaping all the benefits of your existing knowledge



or



b) Seek out your spouse, children and family, explain what has happened and try to be a part of your previous life



Who wants to argue a and who wants to argue b?

Since I do not believe in reincarnation, I cannot argue for either side RW.

You need to think of it on a moral level.

Quote from: "RW"Sorry, I meant philosophical more than moral.

Quote from: "RW"I'll argue b for example.



I would seek out my family, if nothing more than to inform my husband I still exist.  If we could do nothing by communicate via electronic means, I would accept that fate.  Same with my children.  I would contact my original parents and siblings as well.  My relationship with them would be less complicated as I knew them since I was a child. I think it would give my loved ones peace to know I still live in their world.

Quote from: "Annie"I agree Fash, alcohol should be monitored more. It's more dangerous than marijuana.  Although I don't think people should operate equipment or drive while stoned either.

Quote from: "RW"I'll argue b for example.



I would seek out my family, if nothing more than to inform my husband I still exist.  If we could do nothing by communicate via electronic means, I would accept that fate.  Same with my children.  I would contact my original parents and siblings as well.  My relationship with them would be less complicated as I knew them since I was a child.  I think it would give my loved ones peace to know I still live in their world.

Quote from: "Renee"Honestly I think the only choice is "A". After being reborn; by the time you are old enough to make contact with your previous family you are probably already attached and part of your new family. At that point why would you go through the effort and emotional pain of contacting a bunch of people who in all likelihood would be very troubled at your entry into their lives. Your previous family probably wouldn't believe you and would think of your story as a cruel prank. There is a high probability your previous family would think of you as a disturbed stalker. Who needs that noise?



Besides IMHO, the purpose of reincarnation (if it exists) is to move on through a new life experience and not to dwell in the past. The past is over and done, leave it where it belongs.

Quote from: "RW"What about family - parents/siblings, etc?

Quote from: "easter bunny"Most of the people I know of who drank or did drugs were self medicating.  ac_dunno

Quote from: "Mel Gibson"

Quote from: "easter bunny"Most of the people I know of who drank or did drugs were self medicating.  ac_dunno

They were self-medicating a genetic predisposition for substance abuse.



Contrary to "old school" thought, people are genetically wired to abstain, to use, or to abuse.



We try to find a "fix" with meds, but current meds don't work.  They cannot "re-wire" a brain.  They cannot "fix" personality flaws.



Substance abuse isn't typically the outcome of a terrible environment.  It is the outcome of shitty genes.

Quote from: "Mel Gibson"

Quote from: "easter bunny"Most of the people I know of who drank or did drugs were self medicating.  ac_dunno

They were self-medicating a genetic predisposition for substance abuse.



Contrary to "old school" thought, people are genetically wired to abstain, to use, or to abuse.



We try to find a "fix" with meds, but current meds don't work.  They cannot "re-wire" a brain.  They cannot "fix" personality flaws.



Substance abuse isn't typically the outcome of a terrible environment.  It is the outcome of shitty genes.

Quote from: "RW"They say alcoholism is genetic.

Quote from: "RW"They say alcoholism is genetic.

Quote from: "Renee"Only about 40-50% of people with addiction issues have the gene that puts them at risk for substance abuse and even if they do, environmental factors still play a huge part. People using genetics as an excuse to get fucked up are just avoiding personal responsibility. Sorry Mel, but that is the simple truth.

Unfortunately many of us are looking for some kind of crutch to enable our inner demons. One of the unfortunate personal and social side effects of our mapping of the human genome has been the convenient excuse that genetics can now be used to explain many of our personal character flaws. While it is true that genetics does provide the frame work for many of our bad habits it is only one piece of the puzzle. As with everything in life it is our acceptance of personal responsibility that truly controls our behavior and the life decisions that we make.

Quote from: "Fashionista"

Quote from: "Renee"Only about 40-50% of people with addiction issues have the gene that puts them at risk for substance abuse and even if they do, environmental factors still play a huge part. People using genetics as an excuse to get fucked up are just avoiding personal responsibility. Sorry Mel, but that is the simple truth.

Unfortunately many of us are looking for some kind of crutch to enable our inner demons. One of the unfortunate personal and social side effects of our mapping of the human genome has been the convenient excuse that genetics can now be used to explain many of our personal character flaws. While it is true that genetics does provide the frame work for many of our bad habits it is only one piece of the puzzle. As with everything in life it is our acceptance of personal responsibility that truly controls our behavior and the life decisions that we make.

Renee, if one knows that genetically they are more likely to have a problem with alcohol, don't you think those individuals should avoid it more than people that do not.

Quote from: "RW"They say alcoholism is genetic.

Quote from: "Shen Li"

Quote from: "RW"It would be cool, IMHO, to have a thread or section where you have a couple posts each to present an argument and folks vote like a jury.  



Am I too legally nerdy or could this be fun?

Problem with any issue is most minds are made up long before opening arguments are presented.

Quote from: "Azhya Aryola"

Quote from: "Shen Li"

Quote from: "RW"It would be cool, IMHO, to have a thread or section where you have a couple posts each to present an argument and folks vote like a jury.  



Am I too legally nerdy or could this be fun?

Problem with any issue is most minds are made up long before opening arguments are presented.

Exactly. Someone like me for instance already has my mind made up.

Quote from: "RW"They say alcoholism is genetic.

Quote from: "Mel Gibson"

Quote from: "RW"They say alcoholism is genetic.

It is.



My family is a good example of this.  It can be traced through the generations as far back as anyone can remember.



Many people that start drinking can stop after a few.  We cannot, unfortunately.



There has never been an issue with any drugs, either legal or illegal.  Just alcohol.  Somehow the brain in certain individuals like it.



This is not due to environmental issues (i.e. childhood).  It is simply how the brain is wired.

Quote from: "Shen Li"I do not doubt that some people are genetically weaker when it comes to drinking responsibly. However, the people that abuse it that I know all too often have negative lifestyle issues.

Quote from: "Mel Gibson"

Quote from: "Shen Li"I do not doubt that some people are genetically weaker when it comes to drinking responsibly. However, the people that abuse it that I know all too often have negative lifestyle issues.

Their negative lifestyle issues are more likely to be created by their excessive drinking, than some childhood "trauma."

Quote from: "Mel Gibson"One of the biggest untruths that we have been led to believe, is that "all people are created equal."  This is pure and utter bullshit.  Anyone with a brain can see that this is untrue.

Quote from: "Mel Gibson"We all know that some people are just plain dumber than others...  ac_biggrin



On an alcohol related topic, you Asians may be lucky, since many of you cannot really drink like the other races can to begin with, due to genetics... And since the mutation is a genetic issue, there is no cure for this alcohol "flush reaction."

Quote from: "Mel Gibson"I have no doubt that these genes play a role in other addictions as well...  Excessive gambling, excessive eating, excessive drug use, etc.  I believe they are all closely related.



To an obese person, to just "stop eating" may have a similar result as telling a boozer to just "stop drinking" or the gambler to just "stop gambling."

Quote from: "Fashionista"Do other races get flush or is only East Asians?



Sorry for my ignorance.

 ac_blush

Quote from: "Renee"

Quote from: "Mel Gibson"I have no doubt that these genes play a role in other addictions as well...  Excessive gambling, excessive eating, excessive drug use, etc.  I believe they are all closely related.



To an obese person, to just "stop eating" may have a similar result as telling a boozer to just "stop drinking" or the gambler to just "stop gambling."

Genetics does not force the alcohol or the food into your body, Mel.



A genetic predisposition makes it easier for an individual to become addicted but the actual act of facilitating the addiction starts with a conscience decision to drink, take drugs, or over eat. Genetics is only one part of the problem and it's actually a secondary problem. How a person responds to his or her environment and emotions are the main catalyst factors. If genetics was the main determining factor in addiction then getting sober, becoming drug free or losing weight would be all but impossible. Since we both know that's bullshit it kinda makes your argument bullshit as well.

Quote from: "Renee"A genetic predisposition makes it easier for an individual to become addicted but the actual act of facilitating the addiction starts with a conscience decision to drink, take drugs, or over eat. Genetics is only one part of the problem and it's actually a secondary problem. How a person responds to his or her environment and emotions are the main catalyst factors. If genetics was the main determining factor in addiction then getting sober, becoming drug free or losing weight would be all but impossible. Since we both know that's bullshit it kinda makes your argument bullshit as well.

Quote from: "Mel Gibson"

Quote from: "Renee"A genetic predisposition makes it easier for an individual to become addicted but the actual act of facilitating the addiction starts with a conscience decision to drink, take drugs, or over eat. Genetics is only one part of the problem and it's actually a secondary problem. How a person responds to his or her environment and emotions are the main catalyst factors. If genetics was the main determining factor in addiction then getting sober, becoming drug free or losing weight would be all but impossible. Since we both know that's bullshit it kinda makes your argument bullshit as well.

Here is where I disagree.  People don't "become" addicted.  These people are addicted, per se, from birth.



Again, I believe genetics plays more of a factor than environment, and many Shrinks are now starting to accept this fact as well...



And for many, becoming drug free, or losing weight, is all but impossible.  We may see some success stories, but for those, there are many more failures.

Quote from: "Mel Gibson"

Quote from: "Renee"A genetic predisposition makes it easier for an individual to become addicted but the actual act of facilitating the addiction starts with a conscience decision to drink, take drugs, or over eat. Genetics is only one part of the problem and it's actually a secondary problem. How a person responds to his or her environment and emotions are the main catalyst factors. If genetics was the main determining factor in addiction then getting sober, becoming drug free or losing weight would be all but impossible. Since we both know that's bullshit it kinda makes your argument bullshit as well.

Here is where I disagree.  People don't "become" addicted.  These people are addicted, per se, from birth.



Again, I believe genetics plays more of a factor than environment, and many Shrinks are now starting to accept this fact as well...



And for many, becoming drug free, or losing weight, is all but impossible.  We may see some success stories, but for those, there are many more failures.

Quote from: "Mel Gibson"Look into the "Minnesota Twin Study."



Very interesting study.



The Shrinks that disagreed, and even others that agreed with it, have a vested interest to sweep it under the rug.  The reason being?  They have a vested interest in a roster of current and new clients.  It pays their bills.



No conspiracy.  Simply put, Shrinks really don't want the public to know how limited their abilities really are.  They earn money 'fixing' people.  The truth is, many people cannot be 'fixed.'

Quote from: "Renee"Sounds like you are about ready for a membership in the Church of Scientology.  ac_toofunny

Quote from: "Mel Gibson"

Quote from: "Renee"Sounds like you are about ready for a membership in the Church of Scientology.  ac_toofunny

Read the study.  It wasn't some fly-by-night study.  It was conducted over many years.  Have you even heard of it?  It is well known in Shrink circles.



And I'm an Atheist.  No religions or cults for me!

Quote from: "Mel Gibson"I've never said there isn't a choice, ultimately.  The debate here at this point is what is genetic, and what is environmental.  There is a big difference...

Quote from: "Mel Gibson"This discussion is certainly not about me.  It is all-encompassing...

Quote from: "Renee"

Quote from: "Mel Gibson"I've never said there isn't a choice, ultimately.  The debate here at this point is what is genetic, and what is environmental.  There is a big difference...

Sure there is a difference but which one is the determining factor in addiction. You seem to think genetics has destined you to be a raging drunk. I say that's a steaming pile.