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General Discussion => The Flea Trap => Topic started by: Bricktop on August 10, 2015, 07:51:34 PM

Title: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 10, 2015, 07:51:34 PM
By an African American.



With a history of violence.



With a gun.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: asal on August 10, 2015, 07:59:57 PM
Make a subforum to keep track:  Each time a gun is used in mass shootings.  Each time one is successfully used to defend (and they post a story).  If we kept track with a graph - that'd be interesting.  Include the country where the story occurred.  The statistics already exist - but, it'd be a practical way to comment on these stories.



When I worked up north a bear attacked and killed people at Liard hotsprings.  An American had a gun nearby and shot the bear (there were two (2) bears).  It was unusual behaviour for bears - those two (2) bears had something wrong with them.  They weren't grizzlies - I think they were black bears.



//http://www.readersdigest.ca/magazine/rogue-bear-rampage/#GtUmYQSYP0ufxFEm.97
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 10, 2015, 08:01:32 PM
Really? Wow? Why don't we all carry guns, then. Just in case.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: asal on August 10, 2015, 08:02:55 PM
Just in case of bears at hotsprings?



I think that's the argument.  We need guns to defend ourselves.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 10, 2015, 08:18:08 PM
Right.



So we should all carry guns, right? Just to be clear.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: asal on August 10, 2015, 08:29:42 PM
When visiting hotsprings in Northern BC make sure there is an American nearby with a gun.  Always.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 10, 2015, 08:57:32 PM
You are ducking the question.



Should we all carry guns?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Opie Kindred on August 10, 2015, 09:11:44 PM
Quote from: "SPECTRE"You are ducking the question.



Should we all carry guns?


No. We should all carry a Playstation and the latest version of Modern Warfare so that we can follow in your footsteps and channel our violent and psychotic tendencies in a harmless yet satisfying manner. Headshots FTW.   :thumbup:
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 10, 2015, 09:15:49 PM
Quote from: "Opie Kindred"
Quote from: "SPECTRE"You are ducking the question.



Should we all carry guns?


No. We should all carry a Playstation and the latest version of Modern Warfare so that we can follow in your footsteps and channel our violent and psychotic tendencies in a harmless yet satisfying manner. Headshots FTW.

Hello Opie Kindred, it's so nice to see you here again.

 ac_hithere
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 10, 2015, 09:18:00 PM
Quote from: "Opie Kindred"
Quote from: "SPECTRE"You are ducking the question.



Should we all carry guns?


No. We should all carry a Playstation and the latest version of Modern Warfare so that we can follow in your footsteps and channel our violent and psychotic tendencies in a harmless yet satisfying manner. Headshots FTW.   :thumbup:


Things a bit slow at Memebee? The BF clan not working out for you? Still lack testicular fortitude?



How's that pretty brother of yours?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Opie Kindred on August 10, 2015, 09:22:08 PM
Quote from: "Fashionista"... Hello Opie Kindred, it's so nice to see you here again.

 ac_hithere


Hello Fashionista.  ac_hithere
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 10, 2015, 09:25:04 PM
Quote from: "Opie Kindred"
Quote from: "Fashionista"... Hello Opie Kindred, it's so nice to see you here again.

 ac_hithere


Hello Fashionista.  ac_hithere

 ac_smile
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: asal on August 10, 2015, 11:37:37 PM
Quote from: "SPECTRE"You are ducking the question.



Should we all carry guns?


Ordinary people should not carry guns.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 10, 2015, 11:51:00 PM
Ah. So, how to distinguish between "ordinary" and...er..."extraordinary"?



By the way, if that American was carrying a firearm in Canada, would he not be breaking the law.



I'm pretty sure firearms licences and permits do not cross international borders.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: cc on August 11, 2015, 12:07:31 AM
QuoteNo. We should all carry a Playstation and the latest version of Modern Warfare so that we can follow in your footsteps and channel our violent and psychotic tendencies in a harmless yet satisfying manner. Headshots FTW.

Hi Opie!!
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 11, 2015, 12:17:20 AM
That's Granpap to you.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: cc on August 11, 2015, 12:34:33 AM
Ya. I figured that
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 11, 2015, 12:42:27 AM
It's just a shame that one armed person breaking the law was able to hurt scores of unnarmed others following the laws. Progressives and left winger type cowards will continue to call for weapons bans because logic left on the first bus out of Leftyville decades ago and it's never coming back.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: cc on August 11, 2015, 12:43:48 AM
Quotelogic left on the first bus out of Leftyville decades ago and it's never coming back.

lol, I liked that. Seems true things are often funnier than spun tales
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: keeper on August 11, 2015, 12:53:47 AM
Quote from: "SPECTRE"Right.



So we should all carry guns, right? Just to be clear.


What a scary thought, Im so happy we have strict gun laws in Alberta....
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: asal on August 11, 2015, 12:58:32 AM
Quote from: "SPECTRE"Ah. So, how to distinguish between "ordinary" and...er..."extraordinary"?



By the way, if that American was carrying a firearm in Canada, would he not be breaking the law.



I'm pretty sure firearms licences and permits do not cross international borders.


extraordinary are police, military, security.  



That guy who shot the bears - I'm assuming he was a hunter?  He probably was breaking the law to carry a gun in Canada. I don't know gun laws.  He saved people that day.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: keeper on August 11, 2015, 01:01:15 AM
Quote from: "asal"
Quote from: "SPECTRE"Ah. So, how to distinguish between "ordinary" and...er..."extraordinary"?



By the way, if that American was carrying a firearm in Canada, would he not be breaking the law.



I'm pretty sure firearms licences and permits do not cross international borders.


extraordinary are police, military, security.  



That guy who shot the bears - I'm assuming he was a hunter?  He probably was breaking the law to carry a gun in Canada. I don't know gun laws.  He saved people that day.


If im not mistaken you can carry a firearm in you vehicle (not loaded)) not on your person and hand guns are to be transported from point A to B to a gun range.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: asal on August 11, 2015, 01:03:42 AM
Quote from: "Keeper"
Quote from: "asal"
Quote from: "SPECTRE"Ah. So, how to distinguish between "ordinary" and...er..."extraordinary"?



By the way, if that American was carrying a firearm in Canada, would he not be breaking the law.



I'm pretty sure firearms licences and permits do not cross international borders.


extraordinary are police, military, security.  



That guy who shot the bears - I'm assuming he was a hunter?  He probably was breaking the law to carry a gun in Canada. I don't know gun laws.  He saved people that day.


If im not mistaken you can carry a firearm in you vehicle (not loaded)) not on your person and hand guns are to be transported from point A to B to a gun range.


Ok.



I'd like to try shooting at a gun range.  A coworker goes and she said it's fun - but bullets are $1 each.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Romero on August 11, 2015, 01:05:29 AM
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"It's just a shame that one armed person breaking the law was able to hurt scores of unnarmed others following the laws. Progressives and left winger type cowards will continue to call for weapons bans because logic left on the first bus out of Leftyville decades ago and it's never coming back.

Do you believe the murderer shouldn't be banned from owning weapons?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 11, 2015, 01:15:24 AM
Ban? Lol. Silly boy.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: cc on August 11, 2015, 01:21:40 AM
Quote from: "Romero"
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"It's just a shame that one armed person breaking the law was able to hurt scores of unnarmed others following the laws. Progressives and left winger type cowards will continue to call for weapons bans because logic left on the first bus out of Leftyville decades ago and it's never coming back.

Do you believe the murderer shouldn't be banned from owning weapons?
 PLEASE tell me you didn't say that.



PLEASE ac_crying
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: cc on August 11, 2015, 01:46:24 AM
While cops had not had time to verify it, they did say it was almost impossible for him to have had a gun permit  - he had a long  list of  assaults on his record



So he likely was already "banned" from owning a gun, lol
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Romero on August 11, 2015, 01:57:58 AM
Are you saying the murderer should have been really banned from owning a gun? As in he should have never had one in the first place?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: cc on August 11, 2015, 02:23:14 AM
Actually, I was saying
QuoteWhile cops had not had time to verify it, they did say it was almost impossible for him to have had a gun permit - he had a long list of assaults on his record



So he likely was already "banned" from owning a gun

Then, superior progs can speak for others at will, eh?  :wink:
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 11, 2015, 04:32:28 AM
Quote from: "Romero"Are you saying the murderer should have been really banned from owning a gun? As in he should have never had one in the first place?


But if he was banned, how did he get one?



After all, you need a licence, right?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 11, 2015, 11:07:10 AM
8 law abiding people prevented from defending themselves against 1 person who didn't abide by the law so some people call for more laws to curb what the non law abiding type shouldn't continue to do?  :dash1:



How demented is that?



Are we livestock in the West or what?  :2r4ml1j_th:
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: asal on August 11, 2015, 01:37:04 PM
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"8 law abiding people prevented from defending themselves against 1 person who didn't abide by the law so some people call for more laws to curb what the non law abiding type shouldn't continue to do?  :dash1:



How demented is that?



Are we livestock in the West or what?  :2r4ml1j_th:


half of those people were children.



What were they prevented from doing?



There is no way for people to defend themselves.  Even if they had guns - the guns wouldn't be loaded and accessible.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Romero on August 11, 2015, 02:02:40 PM
QuoteNorth Carolina open carry advocate shoots and kills toddler sons



An Iredale County, North Carolina man is in critical condition after shooting and killing two boys, ages 3 and 4, and then shooting himself early Sunday morning.



Fuller was a gun enthusiast who liked to fire weapons at bottles, cans and other targets in the back yard, often while consuming alcohol. He had been shooting all day Saturday, Patterson said, before getting into an argument with his wife, who fled the home fearing for her safety. Shortly after that, Fuller pulled the trigger and ended his sons' lives.



His now-private Facebook profile featured Tea Party slogans and flyers. A woman who remembers running into Fuller earlier in the day of the shootings said that he made it a point to say that he didn't shop anywhere that he couldn't take his gun.



//http://www.rawstory.com/2015/08/north-carolina-open-carry-advocate-shoots-and-kills-toddler-sons-after-domestic-dispute/
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 11, 2015, 02:21:51 PM
Quote from: "asal"
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"8 law abiding people prevented from defending themselves against 1 person who didn't abide by the law so some people call for more laws to curb what the non law abiding type shouldn't continue to do?  :dash1:



How demented is that?



Are we livestock in the West or what?  :2r4ml1j_th:


half of those people were children.



What were they prevented from doing?



There is no way for people to defend themselves.  Even if they had guns - the guns wouldn't be loaded and accessible.


WHY WOULDN'T A PERSONAL DEFENSE WEAPON NOT BE LOADED AND ACCESSIBLE in a home which is being assailed? It was greater than half for the children incidentally. Two adults and the rest were early teens or before.



This is the problem with YOU gun phobic (aka self defense hating people). On one hand you suggest that children or young adults shouldn't have the prospect of learning to respect and understand firearms (tools) by not even having access to them, yet on the other, when 2 adults couldn't get the jump on 1 assailant while 6 other younger human beings were in the abode, they're somehow innocents because they shouldn't know how to defend themselves by a madman or madmen?



Bull, fucking, shit.



Don't pawn off your cowardice and perhaps parental failings (also) because a family became a pod of victims in one instance of misguided trust and inability to recognize clear and present danger. That's what your mantra does. It cultivates victims.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Romero on August 11, 2015, 02:58:56 PM
Yes, every single American including children should all packing heat and ready to blast away at a moment's notice.



What about the right to not want to own a weapon?



No amount of training will ever stop the drunk yahoos accidentally shooting themselves and others while cleaning their guns, showing off or getting pissed off. People "respecting" their firearms are in the news on a daily basis.



Here's a child learning some "self-defence":







If only the gun instructor was armed.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Wulf on August 11, 2015, 03:11:19 PM
Somebody slap Romero, he's hysterical again. :oeudC:
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 11, 2015, 03:30:56 PM
what does a gun cost on the black market in countries where guns aren't in every home?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 11, 2015, 03:46:50 PM
Quote from: "Romero"Yes, every single American including children should all packing heat and ready to blast away at a moment's notice.



What about the right to not want to own a weapon?



No amount of training will ever stop the drunk yahoos accidentally shooting themselves and others while cleaning their guns, showing off or getting pissed off. People "respecting" their firearms are in the news on a daily basis.



Here's a child learning some "self-defence":







If only the gun instructor was armed.


Your one instance (sorry, I'll have to take your word for it sight unseen) negates the deaths of 6 children (teenage and below) in a household of 8 because you feel it's about the right to "not want to own a weapon"?



Excuse me on this, but, man up.



Self defense is not about the types of weapons. It's about the mindset to defend oneself or fellow human beings. Dialing 000 or 911 doesn't get the job done when push comes to shove. Teaching your children how to stay alive in the 10-20 minute period between placing a call (if you or they even can) and a possible visitation by armed thugs in blue to save you and them without accidentally killing you or them, it's a sliding scale of fail.



Self defense can't be legislated out because people like yourself have an aversion to weapons (whether designed as weapons or not).



EVERYTHING is a weapon. Your kitchen knives, your aerosol cans, baseball bats, and anything else you can find. If somebody busts into your home illegally with an illegal firearm which was illegally gotten despite the fact that you and your loved ones always followed "the legal rules", you're shit out of luck according to your ilk. In fact, you're a sacrifice to the "ban it" zombies. Are you happy to die according to that? Are you happy to wait for the police (should you even get the chance to contact them) while your loved ones, children and older ones, sit their helplessly because you have an AVERSION TO SELF DEFENSE?



I'm just about to gag having considered what you've said to me and in general. I'm thinking that any offspring you're a part of producing are going to be perpetual victims, even if they survive life.


Quote from: "RW"what does a gun cost on the black market in countries where guns aren't in every home?


Single or double barrel shotgun goes for about 500 AUD here. 338's about 700. Any pistol about 2-3 times that. 7.62 chambered stuff goes for thousands these days (you'd have to hand reload that caliber and collect your own brass)



Australia went stupid decades ago about personal defense. Now, you call the cops and hope your death is quicker than when they eventually show up. Fucking pussies.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Wulf on August 11, 2015, 03:51:01 PM
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
Quote from: "Romero"Yes, every single American including children should all packing heat and ready to blast away at a moment's notice.



What about the right to not want to own a weapon?



No amount of training will ever stop the drunk yahoos accidentally shooting themselves and others while cleaning their guns, showing off or getting pissed off. People "respecting" their firearms are in the news on a daily basis.



Here's a child learning some "self-defence":







If only the gun instructor was armed.


Your one instance (sorry, I'll have to take your word for it sight unseen) negates the deaths of 6 children (teenage and below) in a household of 8 because you feel it's about the right to "not want to own a weapon"?



Excuse me on this, but, man up.



Self defense is not about the types of weapons. It's about the mindset to defend oneself or fellow human beings. Dialing 000 or 911 doesn't get the job done when push comes to shove. Teaching your children how to stay alive in the 10-20 minute period between placing a call (if you or they even can) and a possible visitation by armed thugs in blue to save you and them without accidentally killing you or them, it's a sliding scale of fail.



Self defense can't be legislated out because people like yourself have an aversion to weapons (whether designed as weapons or not).



EVERYTHING is a weapon. Your kitchen knives, your aerosol cans, baseball bats, and anything else you can find. If somebody busts into your home illegally with an illegal firearm which was illegally gotten despite the fact that you and your loved ones always followed "the legal rules", you're shit out of luck according to your ilk. In fact, you're a sacrifice to the "ban it" zombies. Are you happy to die according to that? Are you happy to wait for the police (should you even get the chance to contact them) while your loved ones, children and older ones, sit their helplessly because you have an AVERSION TO SELF DEFENSE?



I'm just about to gag having considered what you've said to me and in general. I'm thinking that any offspring you're a part of producing are going to be perpetual victims, even if they survive life.


Quote from: "RW"what does a gun cost on the black market in countries where guns aren't in every home?


Single or double barrel shotgun goes for about 500 AUD here. 338's about 700. Any pistol about 2-3 times that. 7.62 chambered stuff goes for thousands these days (you'd have to hand reload that caliber and collect your own brass)



Australia went stupid decades ago about personal defense. Now, you call the cops and hope your death is quicker than when they eventually show up. Fucking pussies.


Are you sure you are an Australian????  :shock:
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 11, 2015, 03:53:23 PM
Um, yeah??
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 11, 2015, 03:58:34 PM
Do you know how rare it is for a person to use a gun for self defence?  Stuff like this happens without warning and takes all but seconds to be fatal.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Wulf on August 11, 2015, 04:02:48 PM
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"Um, yeah??


Sorry, I'm just a bit shocked at your stance on gun use as it pertains to personal responsibility. It's my experience that most of you are perfectly happy rolling over and giving it up to the nanny state.



Maybe there is still a few of you left that aren't totally whipped into submission.  :smiley_thumbs_up_yellow_ani:
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Wulf on August 11, 2015, 04:05:52 PM
Quote from: "RW"Do you know how rare it is for a person to use a gun for self defence?  Stuff like this happens without warning and takes all but seconds to be fatal.


Any idea why that is?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Romero on August 11, 2015, 04:14:52 PM
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"Your one instance (sorry, I'll have to take your word for it sight unseen) negates the deaths of 6 children (teenage and below) in a household of 8 because you feel it's about the right to "not want to own a weapon"?



Excuse me on this, but, man up.



Self defense is not about the types of weapons. It's about the mindset to defend oneself or fellow human beings. Dialing 000 or 911 doesn't get the job done when push comes to shove. Teaching your children how to stay alive in the 10-20 minute period between placing a call (if you or they even can) and a possible visitation by armed thugs in blue to save you and them without accidentally killing you or them, it's a sliding scale of fail.



Self defense can't be legislated out because people like yourself have an aversion to weapons (whether designed as weapons or not).



EVERYTHING is a weapon. Your kitchen knives, your aerosol cans, baseball bats, and anything else you can find. If somebody busts into your home illegally with an illegal firearm which was illegally gotten despite the fact that you and your loved ones always followed "the legal rules", you're shit out of luck according to your ilk. In fact, you're a sacrifice to the "ban it" zombies. Are you happy to die according to that? Are you happy to wait for the police (should you even get the chance to contact them) while your loved ones, children and older ones, sit their helplessly because you have an AVERSION TO SELF DEFENSE?



I'm just about to gag having considered what you've said to me and in general. I'm thinking that any offspring you're a part of producing are going to be perpetual victims, even if they survive life.

I'm not actually advocating against self-defence or gun ownership. I just think things are too friggin' crazy in the US. Believing that every single American should be packing heat ready to blast away is senseless.



I've never once needed a gun. None of my family, friends, coworkers and acquaintances have ever needed a gun.



So what am I supposed to be worried about? I'm a thousand times more likely to be hit by a car or by lightning.



If everyone in my city of Vancouver was walking around packing, it would be as crazy as suddenly finding ourselves in some sort of Mad Max dystopia. There's simply no need. There would be many times more accidental shootings than any self-defence shooting.



Ask Vancouverites and over 99% would be like "A gun? Why the heck would I need a gun?". It's just a different world. And much, much safer.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 11, 2015, 04:17:57 PM
Quote from: "RW"Do you know how rare it is for a person to use a gun for self defence?  Stuff like this happens without warning and takes all but seconds to be fatal.


It's rare in Australia since to own a gun one must allow 24/7 unfettered access by police when they decide to knock on your door and demand to see how your lockers are clearly divided across the house. If somebody busts through your door in Australia with a weapon, you either throw your body at them and hope for the best, but if they have a gun, you're probably already dead (it's illegal to keep a gun outside of its locker as well as chambered with a round).



It's why I don't own a gun. (absolutely pointless!) The cops and Feds are so scared of people defending themselves that most Aussies use creative licence to mitigate home invasions and hope for the very best. None of us rely on our pussified boys in blue though. Those spineless cowards show up late to mop up our blood stains and promise to invoke NEW LAWS via the police unions supporting whatever short lived political party in power. Aussie cops are the biggest pussies I've ever encountered in my life.



Those mental weaklings need a slow and protracted death to mirror all the bullshit actions they were paid to facilitate.


Quote from: "Wulf"
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"Um, yeah??


Sorry, I'm just a bit shocked at your stance on gun use as it pertains to personal responsibility. It's my experience that most of you are perfectly happy rolling over and giving it up to the nanny state.



Maybe there is still a few of you left that aren't totally whipped into submission.  :smiley_thumbs_up_yellow_ani:


About a fifth of us still remember our way of life and real freedom. Unfortunately, the vast majority of morons rule us now and we're simply waiting for the moment to retreat into the interior and do away with the mindless motherfuckers once and for all.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 11, 2015, 04:24:11 PM
Quote from: "Romero"
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"Your one instance (sorry, I'll have to take your word for it sight unseen) negates the deaths of 6 children (teenage and below) in a household of 8 because you feel it's about the right to "not want to own a weapon"?



Excuse me on this, but, man up.



Self defense is not about the types of weapons. It's about the mindset to defend oneself or fellow human beings. Dialing 000 or 911 doesn't get the job done when push comes to shove. Teaching your children how to stay alive in the 10-20 minute period between placing a call (if you or they even can) and a possible visitation by armed thugs in blue to save you and them without accidentally killing you or them, it's a sliding scale of fail.



Self defense can't be legislated out because people like yourself have an aversion to weapons (whether designed as weapons or not).



EVERYTHING is a weapon. Your kitchen knives, your aerosol cans, baseball bats, and anything else you can find. If somebody busts into your home illegally with an illegal firearm which was illegally gotten despite the fact that you and your loved ones always followed "the legal rules", you're shit out of luck according to your ilk. In fact, you're a sacrifice to the "ban it" zombies. Are you happy to die according to that? Are you happy to wait for the police (should you even get the chance to contact them) while your loved ones, children and older ones, sit their helplessly because you have an AVERSION TO SELF DEFENSE?



I'm just about to gag having considered what you've said to me and in general. I'm thinking that any offspring you're a part of producing are going to be perpetual victims, even if they survive life.

I'm not actually advocating against self-defence or gun ownership. I just think things are too friggin' crazy in the US. Thinking that every single American should be packing heat ready to blast away is senseless.



I've never once needed a gun. None of my family, friends, coworkers and acquaintances have ever needed a gun.



So what am I supposed to be worried about? I'm a thousand times more likely to be hit by a car or by lightning.



If everyone in my city of Vancouver was walking around packing, it would be as crazy as suddenly finding ourselves in some sort of Mad Max dystopia. There's simply no need. There would be many times more accidental shootings than any self-defence shooting.


Tens of millions of conceal carry licences have been issued in the US with virtually no blowback. Out of the 300 plus million residents in the US, those tens of millions of licences are still not enough. There is a rifle behind every blade of grass in the US (and Australia, if you think about it).



People either follow the spirit of the law, the letter of the law, and more often, both.



I have hope for your soul, Romero.  ac_smile
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 11, 2015, 04:38:29 PM
Quote from: "Wulf"
Quote from: "RW"Do you know how rare it is for a person to use a gun for self defence?  Stuff like this happens without warning and takes all but seconds to be fatal.


Any idea why that is?

I believe I stated a reason in my previous post.



You can't gun fight your way to safety.  It's a false sense of security.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Romero on August 11, 2015, 05:02:35 PM
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"Tens of millions of conceal carry licences have been issued in the US with virtually no blowback. Out of the 300 plus million residents in the US, those tens of millions of licences are still not enough. There is a rifle behind every blade of grass in the US (and Australia, if you think about it).



People either follow the spirit of the law, the letter of the law, and more often, both.



I have hope for your soul, Romero.  ac_smile

I suppose you don't realize there are 30,000 gun deaths in the US every year. Tens of thousands of injuries. Mass shootings on a weekly basis.



It's nowhere close to anything like that in countries which aren't in a state of war. Including Australia. Gun control appears to work where peole are sane.



Yeah, the US just needs more people ready to shoot each other! That'll make the country more safe. It's been working wonders so far.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Wulf on August 11, 2015, 05:15:50 PM
Quote from: "RW"
Quote from: "Wulf"
Quote from: "RW"Do you know how rare it is for a person to use a gun for self defence?  Stuff like this happens without warning and takes all but seconds to be fatal.


Any idea why that is?

I believe I stated a reason in my previous post.



You can't gun fight your way to safety.  It's a false sense of security.


Really, who taught you that tripe?



I'll tell you what, you can remain unarmed and God forbid if you get attacked, by an armed assailant, let me know how you made it to "safety". If I don't get an answer, I'll just assume whatever strategy you employed didn't work.



I think you are talking to the wrong person on this.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 11, 2015, 05:29:36 PM
Quote from: "Romero"
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"Tens of millions of conceal carry licences have been issued in the US with virtually no blowback. Out of the 300 plus million residents in the US, those tens of millions of licences are still not enough. There is a rifle behind every blade of grass in the US (and Australia, if you think about it).



People either follow the spirit of the law, the letter of the law, and more often, both.



I have hope for your soul, Romero.  ac_smile

I suppose you don't realize there are 30,000 gun deaths in the US every year. Tens of thousands of injuries. Mass shootings on a weekly basis.



It's nowhere close to anything like that in countries which aren't in a state of war. Including Australia. Gun control appears to work where peole are sane.


Break it down for me. Index the populations per capita to the death rates according to various premature expiration's.



HERE in Australia, our gun control policy has done virtually NOTHING to stop gun deaths since Port Arthur. It has however portrayed those who've used guns to defend themselves and later got off in an unfocused light. Australians don't have the stomach for self defense these days, as a whole. Australians view guns like some sacred shovel which only government can subcontract out to jackbooted thugs these days.



I spoke of lily wristed traditional Australians.



I didn't speak of Australian immigrants. They've come from everywhere over the last 4-5 decades and they've never believed in anything our bullshit Aussie government has ever promised, and rightly so. After Port Arthur, most guns got buried. The rest got turned in for a fourth or fifth of their value.



Those hundreds of thousands of firearms still haven't fired any real shots since. Immigrants and true blue Aussies don't want to fire them.



..but they exist.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 11, 2015, 07:49:51 PM
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"8 law abiding people prevented from defending themselves against 1 person who didn't abide by the law so some people call for more laws to curb what the non law abiding type shouldn't continue to do?  :dash1:



How demented is that?



Are we livestock in the West or what?  :2r4ml1j_th:


Well, you may be...on the other hand, here goes the gun nut lobby, again blaming the fact that there are not enough guns.



So, are YOU advocating that everyone should own a firearm?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 11, 2015, 08:11:34 PM
Quote from: "SPECTRE"
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"8 law abiding people prevented from defending themselves against 1 person who didn't abide by the law so some people call for more laws to curb what the non law abiding type shouldn't continue to do?  :dash1:



How demented is that?



Are we livestock in the West or what?  :2r4ml1j_th:


Well, you may be...on the other hand, here goes the gun nut lobby, again blaming the fact that there are not enough guns.



So, are YOU advocating that everyone should own a firearm?


I'm simply pointing out that no government or government official, past or present, can guarantee personal safety by disarming or criminalizing law abiding or law abiding intentioned peoples because it makes their slack arsed jobs easier, despite what still happens (bans or not).



It governments and their little chest beating lackeys are so afraid of people preserving their own lives while they wait for a possible police response, maybe such government cock blowing pieces are shreds of streaky pelican shit on scarecrow burlap shoulders.



Are you advocating that people phone 000 and wait for a response or much quicker death?



Coward much?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 11, 2015, 08:21:05 PM
Ignoring your puerility, I ask, again...are you thus advocating that everyone should bear arms?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 11, 2015, 08:34:38 PM
Are you a mindless drone fixated on only hearing what you desire or is that just a sign of your late age?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 11, 2015, 08:35:47 PM
Quote from: "Wulf"
Quote from: "RW"
Quote from: "Wulf"
Quote from: "RW"Do you know how rare it is for a person to use a gun for self defence?  Stuff like this happens without warning and takes all but seconds to be fatal.


Any idea why that is?

I believe I stated a reason in my previous post.



You can't gun fight your way to safety.  It's a false sense of security.


Really, who taught you that tripe?



I'll tell you what, you can remain unarmed and God forbid if you get attacked, by an armed assailant, let me know how you made it to "safety". If I don't get an answer, I'll just assume whatever strategy you employed didn't work.



I think you are talking to the wrong person on this.

Tell me Wulf, if an armed assailant opens fire on you during a parade giving you mere seconds to react, are you going to live?



Like the statistics say - most people who are shot don't even get the chance to draw their guns for "self defence".
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 11, 2015, 08:37:11 PM
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
Quote from: "SPECTRE"
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"8 law abiding people prevented from defending themselves against 1 person who didn't abide by the law so some people call for more laws to curb what the non law abiding type shouldn't continue to do?  :dash1:



How demented is that?



Are we livestock in the West or what?  :2r4ml1j_th:


Well, you may be...on the other hand, here goes the gun nut lobby, again blaming the fact that there are not enough guns.



So, are YOU advocating that everyone should own a firearm?


I'm simply pointing out that no government or government official, past or present, can guarantee personal safety by disarming or criminalizing law abiding or law abiding intentioned peoples because it makes their slack arsed jobs easier, despite what still happens (bans or not).



It governments and their little chest beating lackeys are so afraid of people preserving their own lives while they wait for a possible police response, maybe such government cock blowing pieces are shreds of streaky pelican shit on scarecrow burlap shoulders.



Are you advocating that people phone 000 and wait for a response or much quicker death?



Coward much?

The government can't guarantee safety?  No fricken way!  



Thanks for the fly by Captain Obvious.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 11, 2015, 08:42:22 PM
:001_rolleyes:



No, thank you Princess Pseudo Socialism-lite.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 11, 2015, 08:43:12 PM
Woot!  I never get called princess :)
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 11, 2015, 08:44:41 PM
Something shamefully dies in someone every single day. :)
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 11, 2015, 08:55:02 PM
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"Are you a mindless drone fixated on only hearing what you desire or is that just a sign of your late age?


Perhaps, rather than regale us with your schoolyard level debating technique and penchant for personal abuse in lieu of reason, you may wish to address the question.



As to your implication of my fortitude, I'll treat that with the contempt it deserves...particularly when it is expectorated by someone who feels compelled to disguise their voice in a Skype chat.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Wulf on August 11, 2015, 10:32:51 PM
Quote from: "RW"
Quote from: "Wulf"
Quote from: "RW"
Quote from: "Wulf"
Quote from: "RW"Do you know how rare it is for a person to use a gun for self defence?  Stuff like this happens without warning and takes all but seconds to be fatal.


Any idea why that is?

I believe I stated a reason in my previous post.



You can't gun fight your way to safety.  It's a false sense of security.


Really, who taught you that tripe?



I'll tell you what, you can remain unarmed and God forbid if you get attacked, by an armed assailant, let me know how you made it to "safety". If I don't get an answer, I'll just assume whatever strategy you employed didn't work.



I think you are talking to the wrong person on this.

Tell me Wulf, if an armed assailant opens fire on you during a parade giving you mere seconds to react, are you going to live?



Like the statistics say - most people who are shot don't even get the chance to draw their guns for "self defence".


How many people besides the police and active military personnel who get shot are actually armed? I think the statistics you are referring to don't really exist. I'm curious as to where you are getting them.



BTW, don't talk to me about being fired upon by armed assailants. Because there is a very good chance that I'm the only person here who has experienced something like that with possible exception of the inspector. I can say with all certainly that it doesn't happen quite like you would think it does. The bad guy isn't always composed enough or trained enough to actually end up on top. It takes more than just the ability to pull a trigger for a person to find a target and kill. The scenario you are suggesting is probably one of the most survivable situations you could face as an armed citizen. There are literally dozens of variables at play.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 11, 2015, 10:37:41 PM
I'm not talking about playing army Wulf.



I feel far more secure knowing the guy beside me is probably not carrying a gun than I would otherwise.  You can't arm that kind of security.  Sorry.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 11, 2015, 11:05:14 PM
Quote from: "Wulf"The bad guy isn't always composed enough or trained enough to actually end up on top.


A factor for which we are very much grateful.



Grace under fire will keep you alive.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 12, 2015, 04:30:33 AM
Quote from: "SPECTRE"You are ducking the question.



Should we all carry guns?
 Considering any asshole can obtain a fire arm via the back of a seedy van or the Internet black market, yes. Anyone should have freedom to arm themselves. The fun is, you never know who is packing heat. Limiting access to drugs didn't exactly put a dent in the addiction epidemic.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 12, 2015, 04:32:39 AM
Quote from: "Wulf"
Quote from: "RW"Do you know how rare it is for a person to use a gun for self defence?  Stuff like this happens without warning and takes all but seconds to be fatal.


Any idea why that is?

 Because you never know who has one lol. Take away guns and watch the crime rate sky rocket because criminals will know you are unarmed.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 12, 2015, 12:38:05 PM
Quote from: "Dove"
Quote from: "Wulf"
Quote from: "RW"Do you know how rare it is for a person to use a gun for self defence?  Stuff like this happens without warning and takes all but seconds to be fatal.


Any idea why that is?

 Because you never know who has one lol. Take away guns and watch the crime rate sky rocket because criminals will know you are unarmed.

Is that how it works?  Funny, here in Canada we can't walk around armed and our violent crime hasn't skyrocketed.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: cc on August 12, 2015, 01:16:42 PM
Say RW. There is a potential problem when one wants to post an "attachment" ..... at least there is with Chrome



When one first goes into "preview" , one finds only the "options" that I have shown in this attachment below - "Options" is all that is visible . Clicking on anything will not bring up an "Attachment" option



I stumbled into the workaround, but only by accident and several fails. The only way one can attach any thing is to actually preview the post. After previewing it  "attachments" appears  at that location and can be utilized



Just start a new post at the bottom, click "full editor & preview". Then look at where "attach a file" should appear.  



Not a biggy - Just thought you should know people cannot add an attachment unless they luck into what I lucked into.

If my description is confusing, just say so and I can clarify
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 12, 2015, 07:12:31 PM
Quote from: "Dove"
Quote from: "Wulf"
Quote from: "RW"Do you know how rare it is for a person to use a gun for self defence?  Stuff like this happens without warning and takes all but seconds to be fatal.


Any idea why that is?

 Because you never know who has one lol. Take away guns and watch the crime rate sky rocket because criminals will know you are unarmed.


In every other western country that prohibits personal possession of firearms, or severely limits it, the crime rate is around the same as the US.



Except in one area; violence involving firearms. In that category the US can, for once, rightfully claim it leads the western world.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 12, 2015, 07:15:09 PM
Quote from: "cc la femme"Say RW. There is a potential problem when one wants to post an "attachment" ..... at least there is with Chrome



When one first goes into "preview" , one finds only the "options" that I have shown in this attachment below - "Options" is all that is visible . Clicking on anything will not bring up an "Attachment" option



I stumbled into the workaround, but only by accident and several fails. The only way one can attach any thing is to actually preview the post. After previewing it  "attachments" appears  at that location and can be utilized



Just start a new post at the bottom, click "full editor & preview". Then look at where "attach a file" should appear.  



Not a biggy - Just thought you should know people cannot add an attachment unless they luck into what I lucked into.

If my description is confusing, just say so and I can clarify

Thanks for letting me know.  I'll look into it.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 12, 2015, 09:53:13 PM
Quote from: "RW"
Quote from: "Dove"
Quote from: "Wulf"
Quote from: "RW"Do you know how rare it is for a person to use a gun for self defence?  Stuff like this happens without warning and takes all but seconds to be fatal.


Any idea why that is?

 Because you never know who has one lol. Take away guns and watch the crime rate sky rocket because criminals will know you are unarmed.

Is that how it works?  Funny, here in Canada we can't walk around armed and our violent crime hasn't skyrocketed.
  Well why don't you cross the Detroit river for a stroll around the nieghborhood?  I envy your safety, but Canada isn't exactly know for violant crime. The US is. Disarming law abiding citizens at the point leaves us vulnerable to the criminals who don't get guns legally.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 13, 2015, 12:58:30 AM
How do they get their guns then?



Is there a special gun manufacturer for bad people only??
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 13, 2015, 01:12:16 AM
Quote from: "SPECTRE"How do they get their guns then?



Is there a special gun manufacturer for bad people only??

 Anyone can get a gun. You can buy illegal weapons off the internet.  I could just stroll on down to my old drug dealers house and make an offer on a fire arm, and I'd get ine.  Look at it realistically.  Crack is illegal. Heroin is illegal. I can get both of those AND a gun to go with it within 24 hours if i wanted to.  Do you think the majority of our violant crimes are committed by law abiding citizens who obtained their gun rightly?  Because you'd be wrong on that.  The problem isn't guns.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 13, 2015, 01:16:50 AM
http://gizmodo.com/5927379/the-secret-online-weapons-store-thatll-sell-anyone-anything For those who don't feel like a trip to the hood, you can download tor and shop online for whatever fire arm you wish off the cyber black market.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 13, 2015, 01:17:13 AM
Yeah the problem is people.  So why give em guns?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 13, 2015, 01:25:49 AM
How is taking guns away from law abiding citizens going to stop criminals?  You gonna stop criminals from black market buying fire arms? Gonna stop illegal selling and owning of guns?  Criminals can have guns, but the innocent have to be vunerable?  The laws don't stop criminals. Also, what about hunters?  What about a tyrannical government?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 13, 2015, 01:28:20 AM
People are also addicts. So why give them drugs?  Oh wait.....drugs are illegal.  Funny how heroin is epidemic?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 13, 2015, 02:43:53 AM
Quote from: "Dove"The problem isn't guns.


Yes.



It is.



Why do you think most of the modern civilised world forbids possession of them? And thus have less than 10% of gun related fatalities than the US.



If we follow your logic, nations that ban possession of any kind of firearm, such as Japan, Australia, France and so on should be a gangsters paradise.



But they're not.



Why is that?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 13, 2015, 02:52:43 AM
Disregarding everything else I said.  So, somehow a gun causes a person to become violant or suicidal. I see.  Yanno, the theme here in general....with most of these debates...seems to be "let's remove responsibility from human beings".   Poverty is the culprit, really, considering the highest gun violance in the US is in states with high levels of poverty.  Do you think the majority of these people are buying guns legally?  Answer this question, Crack is illegal. So why do we have so many Crack heads?  Here in the US, it is not guns that is the problem. Taking away guns will NOT stop any violance, it won't stop would be criminals and established criminals from committing gun violance. It will only make law abiding citizens vunerable. You don't really understand our ever degrading culture here. Not to mention, it violates our Constitution to ban them.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 13, 2015, 03:01:30 AM
http://time.com/3946904/heroin-epidemic/   Wow....how on earth are all these people getting and abusing heroin??  It's clearly illegal!
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: asal on August 13, 2015, 03:05:19 AM
visit canada dove.  We are less vulnerable than Americans.  Vancouver has a lot of gun violence amongst criminals.  They kill each other, and relatives of each other.



Killing people takes energy.  Most people are too lazy to kill people for no reason.  Therefore, Canadians can chill.  Violence on non gun holders rarely happens except domestic violence - which is often stabbing and fires.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 13, 2015, 03:08:45 AM
:2r4ml1j_th:
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 13, 2015, 03:12:17 AM
Quote from: "Dove"Disregarding everything else I said.  So, somehow a gun causes a person to become violant or suicidal. I see.  Yanno, the theme here in general....with most of these debates...seems to be "let's remove responsibility from human beings".   Poverty is the culprit, really, considering the highest gun violance in the US is in states with high levels of poverty.  Do you think the majority of these people are buying guns legally?  Answer this question, Crack is illegal. So why do we have so many Crack heads?  Here in the US, it is not guns that is the problem. Taking away guns will NOT stop any violance, it won't stop would be criminals and established criminals from committing gun violance. It will only make law abiding citizens vunerable. You don't really understand our ever degrading culture here. Not to mention, it violates our Constitution to ban them.


I know a LOT about violence. I know that a violent person without a gun is far easier to deal with than a violent person with a gun.



America's addiction to violence and guns will, in the not too distant future, bring about tragedy on a massive scale. As your society continues to fracture, sooner or later the various social groups will simply go to war on each other.



Incidents such as that which occurred in Ferguson will precipitate a massive social upheaval.



And then all those precious, Constitutionally protected guns of yours will come out to play.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 13, 2015, 03:20:02 AM
I used to go to winsor all the time. It's a lot different across the river.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 13, 2015, 03:20:34 AM
Rivers don't stop bullets.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 13, 2015, 03:23:01 AM
Quote from: "SPECTRE"
Quote from: "Dove"Disregarding everything else I said.  So, somehow a gun causes a person to become violant or suicidal. I see.  Yanno, the theme here in general....with most of these debates...seems to be "let's remove responsibility from human beings".   Poverty is the culprit, really, considering the highest gun violance in the US is in states with high levels of poverty.  Do you think the majority of these people are buying guns legally?  Answer this question, Crack is illegal. So why do we have so many Crack heads?  Here in the US, it is not guns that is the problem. Taking away guns will NOT stop any violance, it won't stop would be criminals and established criminals from committing gun violance. It will only make law abiding citizens vunerable. You don't really understand our ever degrading culture here. Not to mention, it violates our Constitution to ban them.


I know a LOT about violence. I know that a violent person without a gun is far easier to deal with than a violent person with a gun.



America's addiction to violence and guns will, in the not too distant future, bring about tragedy on a massive scale. As your society continues to fracture, sooner or later the various social groups will simply go to war on each other.



Incidents such as that which occurred in Ferguson will precipitate a massive social upheaval.



And then all those precious, Constitutionally protected guns of yours will come out to play.
  It's not the legally owned guns causing all the problems. What part of this are you struggling with? And yes, we are so fractured we are headed for some serious crap....so let's go ahead and DISARM the good guys. Makes perfect sense! What delusion are you having where you think violant criminals with guns are going to be deterred by banning guns?  Most of these degenerates didn't get the guns legally. And even IF a few did, banning them won't stop them from getting them illegally. So why disarm everyone else?  You CAN'T disarm American criminals anymore than you can get heroin and Crack off the street.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 13, 2015, 03:25:43 AM
If it is not the legally owned guns, which ones?



I ask again, is there some factory somewhere that makes guns for gangsters, and distributes them to underground dealers?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 13, 2015, 03:29:53 AM
Quote from: "SPECTRE"If it is not the legally owned guns, which ones?



I ask again, is there some factory somewhere that makes guns for gangsters, and distributes them to underground dealers?
 Yes, actually. I posted a link that was discussing this.  I even told you I know how to get a gun illegally.  Government and laws don't stop criminals from being criminals.  People still bang dope, street walk and buy and use illegal fire arms. All against the law. Go fuckin figure?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 13, 2015, 03:31:56 AM
Spec, do you think the black market is some fairytale?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 13, 2015, 03:57:54 AM
You are missing my point. I read your post. Where do the guns that fall into the hands of villains originate from?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 13, 2015, 04:57:45 AM
Quote from: "SPECTRE"You are missing my point. I read your post. Where do the guns that fall into the hands of villains originate from?
  Who knows. Other criminals. It's not your average law abiding citizen who hunts, or owns a private party store in a low income area, or the single mom who wants to be protected. So why strip their rights during such an unstable and violant time in our culture? Banning guns won't keep them out of the hands of dangerous people.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: asal on August 13, 2015, 05:28:11 AM
Quote from: "Dove"I used to go to winsor all the time. It's a lot different across the river.

It's good you had that experience to compare.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: asal on August 13, 2015, 05:31:44 AM
Quote from: "Dove"
Quote from: "SPECTRE"You are missing my point. I read your post. Where do the guns that fall into the hands of villains originate from?
  Who knows. Other criminals.

Some from robberies / that makes the case for less guns in law abiding populace.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 13, 2015, 05:57:37 AM
Quote from: "asal"
Quote from: "Dove"
Quote from: "SPECTRE"You are missing my point. I read your post. Where do the guns that fall into the hands of villains originate from?
  Who knows. Other criminals.

Some from robberies / that makes the case for less guns in law abiding populace.
  if they are law abiding places, it makes no sense to remove guns.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: asal on August 13, 2015, 06:03:25 AM
Quote from: "Dove"
Quote from: "asal"
Quote from: "Dove"
Quote from: "SPECTRE"You are missing my point. I read your post. Where do the guns that fall into the hands of villains originate from?
  Who knows. Other criminals.

Some from robberies / that makes the case for less guns in law abiding populace.
  if they are law abiding places, it makes no sense to remove guns.

They are potential victims of robberies.  Leaving the guns makes them accessible to be stolen.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: asal on August 13, 2015, 06:27:19 AM
Did I win again?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Wulf on August 13, 2015, 08:13:04 AM
Quote from: "asal"Did I win again?


NO and I suggest you do something about that mindset. I suspect you have grown up under the practice of everyone gets a trophy simply for participation.



The number of firearms stolen from private law abiding citizens and then used in commission of a crime is minute in comparison to the illegal guns gained by nefarious means. Don't believe it; just do the research into the ATF statistics. The majority of individuals who go through the trouble of appling for a firearms purchasing permit are responsible gun owners who make the effort to secure their firearms properly. Despite media sensation and the massive efforts of anti-gun lobbies and politicians, a credible link between violent crime and law abiding gun ownership has never been proven and I doubt it ever will be because it simply doesn't exist.



The reality is anti-gun laws amount to nothing but feel good legislation that have no effect on violent gun related crime. Anti-gun laws are nothing but useless feathers in the caps of power hungry politicians so that they can thump their chests when election time comes around. That way, fools like you can gush with feelings of safety and adoration for your political masters while you run to the voting booth.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 13, 2015, 08:27:19 AM
Whilst venting your spleen of cynicism, would YOU care to explain why your crime rate is roughly similar to pretty much all modern industrialised first-world nations that do not permit gun ownership, or severely limit it?



Put another way, in Australia gun ownership is strictly controlled. By your logic, we should be in the tyrannical grip of crime gangs, and our homes under seige from would be burglars.



But we are not in that situation.



Nor are any other comparable countries.



Doesn't that suggest that gun ownership as a crime prevention measure is fruitless? So, pouring more and more guns into your communities merely guarantees that more and more criminals will come into possession of them?



And where do these nefarious guns come from? The Gun Internet?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 13, 2015, 11:08:41 AM
Legal gun ownership is strictly controlled in Australia.



It's why the black market here is so big and not just for firearms. There are plenty of people who trade in quality crossbows and slingshots also, plus ammo. Ammo is huge when there are hundreds of thousands of now illegal firearms which people rightly didn't hand in for a pittance of their worth need to keep a steady supply of reloaded casings with viable powder in them for their unique gear.



Australia is awash in illegal weaponry held by otherwise law abiding people. That's what Australia's draconian gun control legislation did. It created a falsehood.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Wulf on August 13, 2015, 11:17:45 AM
Quote from: "SPECTRE"Whilst venting your spleen of cynicism, would YOU care to explain why your crime rate is roughly similar to pretty much all modern industrialised first-world nations that do not permit gun ownership, or severely limit it?



Put another way, in Australia gun ownership is strictly controlled. By your logic, we should be in the tyrannical grip of crime gangs, and our homes under seige from would be burglars.



But we are not in that situation.



Nor are any other comparable countries.



Doesn't that suggest that gun ownership as a crime prevention measure is fruitless? So, pouring more and more guns into your communities merely guarantees that more and more criminals will come into possession of them?



And where do these nefarious guns come from? The Gun Internet?




I find it difficult to wrap my head around the fact that you are a former member of the law enforcement community and yet you do not know the answer to your question. Nor do you seem to be able to make the connection between violent crime, demographics, socioeconomic disparity and illegal emigration. You bitch and moan about many of these issues but you don't seem to be able to make the correlation between them and the plague of criminal gun violence in the US. Obviously either things in OZ are very different than in the States or you are like most socialist nanny state stooges and can only grasp concepts planted in your head by lazy power seeking politicians who aren't up to the challenge of addressing societies root corruption.



Please see the link provided and you will have your answer on where most criminals get their guns.  



 "ATF agent Jay Wachtel says that most guns used in crimes are not stolen out of private gun owners' homes and cars. "Stolen guns account for only about 10% to 15% of guns used in crimes,"



http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/guns/procon/guns.html



Well I guess this kind of explains it.



http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-05-26/source-of-illicit-guns-in-australia/6483762



It's apparent from the above link that most Australians including their politicians and law enforcement don't have the slightest clue where their illegal guns come from. They simply haven't figured it out yet. :laugh3:  So I guess your ignorance and confusion regarding this facet of the issue can be excused. But in all fairness, unlike the US, indicators point to a significant portion of your gun crime probably comes from all those heavily restricted, privately owned firearms that fall into the wrong hands. Maybe the government of Australia is correct in assuming it's citizens are truly too stupid and irresponsible to keep anything more than a sharp stick in their possession,.......I don't know and it would appear right now that neither do you.



I just have one question, why do Aussies like you have to jump on the social woes of the US and other countries when you obviously still have a ways to go in sorting out your own shit? We know we have problems, we don't really need people like you to point them out, thanks anyway. Is just pure unabated arrogance or is it the fact that life in OZ is so damned boring that you need something to occupy your minds in order to stop your brain tissue from turning to oatmeal?  This not meant to be facetious in any way, I'm seriously curious.   ac_umm   And it's not just you, Canadians, Brits, Aussies all seem to be fascinated with the US society and they seem to be all too eager to sputter out criticism that even "Captain Obvious" would be embarrassed to have pour from his or her mouth.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 13, 2015, 08:22:33 PM
Well now, aside from the fact that your references merely highlight the fact that criminals access their guns through tapping in to lawful ownership or acquistition procedures; a point which does not in any way negate the fact that the overwhelming availability of guns is the root cause, you ask why we constantly slap the US.



It is simple. The US is a net exporter of its toxins. That includes guns, fast food, cigarettes and tobacco and violence based mass media entertainment.



Commensurate with that, the US constantly proclaims itself to be the world's greatest democracy, the "leader of the free world", and the greatest nation on earth which seems then to validate the fact that it fucks up other countries with its violent demeanour.



The US is the world's biggest arms dealer. Where do these arms go? Where did ISIS get their Javelins, and Humvees, and APC's that are stamped "Made In America".



See, its a macrocosmic version of your own society. Flood the place with lethal weaponry, and then stand aghast when bad guys join in the feast.



America has misled itself and humanity for far too long. Even after disastrous interventions in Korea, Vietnam, Lebanon and South America that produced very valuable lessons about global military interventions, YOU still invaded Iraq...asking all your buddies to join in...and look at the mess you've left behind.



So, at every opportunity, I and others try to reflect what the rest of the world sees and thinks so that you will accept a more accurate perspective about your nation's status in the world, and thus use that "world's greatest democracy" philisophy to change the way your respective governments and corporations behave.



Hope that clears that up for you.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: asal on August 13, 2015, 11:13:15 PM
Quote from: "Wulf"
Quote from: "Spectre"And where do these nefarious guns come from? The Gun Internet?




Please see the link provided and you will have your answer on where most criminals get their guns.  



 "ATF agent Jay Wachtel says that most guns used in crimes are not stolen out of private gun owners' homes and cars. "Stolen guns account for only about 10% to 15% of guns used in crimes,"



http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/guns/procon/guns.html


^I appreciate the info Wulf, because I know nothing about these things.



from the frontline link:  



1.Wachtel says one of the most common ways criminals get guns is through straw purchase sales. A straw purchase occurs when someone who may not legally acquire a firearm, or who wants to do so anonymously, has a companion buy it on their behalf.



2.The next biggest source of illegal gun transactions where criminals get guns are sales made by legally licensed but corrupt at-home and commercial gun dealers. Several recent reports back up Wachtel's own studies about this, and make the case that illegal activity by those licensed to sell guns, known as Federal Firearms Licensees (FFLs), is a huge source of crime guns and greatly surpasses the sale of guns stolen from John Q. Citizen. ...According to a recent ATF report, there is a significant diversion to the illegal gun market from FFLs. The report states that "of the 120,370 crime guns that were traced to purchases from the FFLs then in business, 27.7 % of these firearms were seized by law enforcement in connection with a crime within two years of the original sale. This rapid `time to crime' of a gun purchased from an FFL is a strong indicator that the initial seller or purchaser may have been engaged in unlawful activity."



conclusion:  What's needed, according to Wachtel, is better monitoring of the activities of legally licensed gun dealers. This means examining FFL paperwork to see where their guns are coming from, and making sure that those guns are being sold legally.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 14, 2015, 12:05:30 AM
What's needed is for America to grow up and realise that guns are abhorrent in modern society. It needs to stop living in fear of itself, African Americans and the other gangs its imported. It needs to understand that if someone breaks into a home and steals your new 60" LCD TV it is not an excuse for a shootout. It needs to accept that its "founding fathers" were not endowed by god to implement a Constitution that forever remains enshrined as a blueprint for modern civilisation. It needs to reflect on its impact on the world in general, and to accept that not every problem that arises demands its intervention. It needs to accept that other forms of government, anathema as they may be, may be better than ANY alternative, including America's form of "democracy". It needs to recognise its deeply rooted social tectonic plates and deal with them. It needs to recognise that wealth and worldly possessions are not the purpose of human existence. It needs to recognise its Government is corrupt and disconnected from the hopes and dreams of its citizens.



It needs a reboot.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 14, 2015, 01:27:50 AM
You can get on TOR and go to the armory and buy grenades, ffs.  So yes, spec, you can go to Internet gun stores. You can buy from human trafficking sites on the deep web.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 14, 2015, 03:19:07 AM
No, that's a cop out.



Once again, you say this like it is normal.



But what you fail to understand...constantly...is that we all live in the same world, yet only YOU are so obsessed and addicted to lethal firearms. Not the UK. Not Denmark. Not Thailand. Either you suffer a significant cultural flaw, or you simply cannot understand what you are doing to yourselves.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 14, 2015, 03:24:46 AM
Quote from: "SPECTRE"No, that's a cop out.



Once again, you say this like it is normal.



But what you fail to understand...constantly...is that we all live in the same world, yet only YOU are so obsessed and addicted to lethal firearms. Not the UK. Not Denmark. Not Thailand. Either you suffer a significant cultural flaw, or you simply cannot understand what you are doing to yourselves.
  It's not a cop out. It's reality. You may not want to accept that reality, but it is still happening. Gun violance isn't committed by permit carrying law abiding citizens....so guns should be removed from them.  The focus should be more on controlling the illegal black market and the criminals. Not stripping rights away from innocent citizens.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 14, 2015, 03:59:26 AM
Dove...pour 10 millions firearms into a nation. What percentage of those so-called "legal" firearms are used by criminals? Let's say 10%. That's 1 million firearms in the hands of would be villains.



In 2013, 21 MILLION firearms were purchased in the US. 21 MILLION. If 10% falls into the "wrong hands" that is STILL 2.1 MILLION handguns in the wrong hands.



Why does a modern, civilised nation need to buy 21 MILLION handguns in a single year? They serve a single purpose. To KILL.



Actually, I'm misleading you. They serve TWO purposes. to kill, and to make gun manufacturers rich.



Its insane. No other country owns guns at the volume per capita that you do.



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Number_of_guns_per_capita_by_country



And that is why 30,000 plus of your citizens die each year from gun related death.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 14, 2015, 04:14:50 AM
You really have no idea what America is really like. The only thing that keeps the businesses safe in the city I live in is the right the owners have to arm themselves.  We need to deal with poverty and the illegal fire arms that FAR out number the legal ones. Not strip rights away from noncriminals.  That's like saying the way to stop the heroin epidemic is to take pain patients prescriptions away. It makes no sense and doesn't address the problem.  You don't strip rights from innocent people in order to clean up criminals.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 14, 2015, 06:45:50 AM
Quote from: "Dove"You really have no idea what America is really like. The only thing that keeps the businesses safe in the city I live in is the right the owners have to arm themselves.  We need to deal with poverty and the illegal fire arms that FAR out number the legal ones. Not strip rights away from noncriminals.  That's like saying the way to stop the heroin epidemic is to take pain patients prescriptions away. It makes no sense and doesn't address the problem.  You don't strip rights from innocent people in order to clean up criminals.


Most Australians don't understand America and its background nor do they want to understand it because we here are indoctrinated otherwise by our politicians and mass media.



You're not going to get anywhere with him on this topic especially so if he was actually a cop. The idea that people could defend themselves against their government and their uniformed officers or soldiers scares the shit out of them and Australia has a very dicey history in that regard.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 14, 2015, 07:31:23 AM
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
Quote from: "Dove"You really have no idea what America is really like. The only thing that keeps the businesses safe in the city I live in is the right the owners have to arm themselves.  We need to deal with poverty and the illegal fire arms that FAR out number the legal ones. Not strip rights away from noncriminals.  That's like saying the way to stop the heroin epidemic is to take pain patients prescriptions away. It makes no sense and doesn't address the problem.  You don't strip rights from innocent people in order to clean up criminals.


Most Australians don't understand America and its background nor do they want to understand it because we here are indoctrinated otherwise by our politicians and mass media.



You're not going to get anywhere with him on this topic especially so if he was actually a cop. The idea that people could defend themselves against their government and their uniformed officers or soldiers scares the shit out of them and Australia has a very dicey history in that regard.

The American government has tanks and fighter jets and shit.  WTF are guns against that?  LOL!  Fight back against the government.  That's ridiculous.



Get with the times.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Wulf on August 14, 2015, 08:22:07 AM
Quote from: "RW"
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
Quote from: "Dove"You really have no idea what America is really like. The only thing that keeps the businesses safe in the city I live in is the right the owners have to arm themselves.  We need to deal with poverty and the illegal fire arms that FAR out number the legal ones. Not strip rights away from noncriminals.  That's like saying the way to stop the heroin epidemic is to take pain patients prescriptions away. It makes no sense and doesn't address the problem.  You don't strip rights from innocent people in order to clean up criminals.


Most Australians don't understand America and its background nor do they want to understand it because we here are indoctrinated otherwise by our politicians and mass media.



You're not going to get anywhere with him on this topic especially so if he was actually a cop. The idea that people could defend themselves against their government and their uniformed officers or soldiers scares the shit out of them and Australia has a very dicey history in that regard.

The American government has tanks and fighter jets and shit.  WTF are guns against that?  LOL!  Fight back against the government.  That's ridiculous.



Get with the times.


And it's troops have to have the willingness to turn those weapons on their own people, ......family/friends. Not going to happen.



Get with reality.



I want to remind you that throughout history governments have ALWAYS been better equipped than the revolutionaries. That has not always been the deciding factor in a violent struggle for change. The US itself is living proof of that. Canadians and Aussies will never understand because your national psyche was and it think still is, one of ambivalence when it comes to your independence. You people got what was left of the tyrant after what we in the US went thru. 18TH century British ego and their overbearing heavy handed style of governing was severely reduced and forever changed after they got humiliated in front of the entire world (TWICE) I might add, by the fledgling US. It was a case where a vastly superior military force learn hard lessons that have been repeated over and over again by governments all over the world.

Your people have never been thru it so it has not shaped or effected your way of thinking.  It's a good thing because if pushed into an untenable position by your governments you are I'll equipped to do anything about it. And unfortunately, you are all too pussified at this point to do more than whine and cry. That sad fact is played out and evident right here on this forum day after day.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 14, 2015, 08:50:31 AM
We kept your asses out didn't we?



And thanks for making my point about guns arming against military.  It is ridiculous.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Wulf on August 14, 2015, 09:53:26 AM
Quote from: "RW"We kept your asses out didn't we?



And thanks for making my point about guns arming against military.  It is ridiculous.

 

 :oeudC:  



Not sure where you get the idea that I proved anything in respect to your......"point". Is reading comprehension taught THAT differently north of the US border?[/quote]



Oh BTW,  It's always amusing when you Canadians beat your chest over Quebec, Isn't great to be proud of an 18th century military victory where a grossly untrained, small pox ravaged, band of American Militia (farmers and shop keepers) where defeated by 10,000 British regulars, an unknown number of Indian allies and Canadian loyalist grovelers, who held a defensive strategic advantage. All in the dead of winter I might add.



I'll tell you what, if you DIDN'T win that one, you would never have been able to live it down.   :laugh3: So instead of "pride" maybe "relief" should be what you feel when you think of your involvement in the American Revolution. But regardless of what happened at Quebec, at the ultimate end you were still saddled with mentally deficient George and company running the show while the American colonies were free to govern themselves.  Now ask yourself how that happened.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 14, 2015, 10:14:48 AM
The part where you agreed with me that the military is better equipped than the populace.  That chucks out the whole "we need guns to keep the government in line" crap right out the window.



Don't worry Wulf, my reading comprehension is better than your spelling ;)
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Wulf on August 14, 2015, 10:45:41 AM
Quote from: "RW"The part where you agreed with me that the military is better equipped than the populace.  That chucks out the whole "we need guns to keep the government in line" crap right out the window.



Don't worry Wulf, my reading comprehension is better than your spelling ;)


You obviously didn't read beyond the second sentence in my previous post. You do know that there is more to debate than just cherry picking the opponents information and responding in a disingenuous manner, don'tcha? Are we taking lessons from Romero now?



If you are going to ignore the main part of an opponents counterpoint then there is no reason to debate. This goes back to a previous point I made in another thread where I stated that most so-called debate in venues like this is nothing but wasted time. Thanks for proving MY point. :smiley_thumbs_up_yellow_ani:
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 14, 2015, 10:47:59 AM
You are the grumpiest pessimist I know!



I'm not wrong when I say it's a ridiculous argument for gun ownership.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Wulf on August 14, 2015, 11:03:03 AM
Quote from: "RW"You are the grumpiest pessimist I know!



I'm not wrong when I say it's a ridiculous argument for gun ownership.


"Pessimist"?????......No, "realist" the proper term. But I am grumpy, I'll give you that.



I say you are wrong. I have history and military experience and tactical knowledge on my side, what do you have...Opinion? last I checked opinion is not good enough to prove a point.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 14, 2015, 12:14:52 PM
Tell me where I'm wrong.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Wulf on August 14, 2015, 12:52:15 PM
Quote from: "RW"Tell me where I'm wrong.


You are wrong in the idea that just because a government has superior weaponry it can't be challenged by an armed populace. Have you NOT been paying attention to what is going on in Syria lately?



I already pointed to the American Revolution but there are tons more recent happenings that point to you being wrong. Take for example the Russian Revolution, the Cuban Revolution, the Vietnam war, Even the Nazi take over of the German Democratic government. How many of those challenges to the established government do you think would have been successful if the revolutionaries were unarmed????? I'll tell you how many......NONE.



Do you think a revolution just happens overnight? Do you think that one day an ass load of malcontents just get out of bed and say..."Okay boys and girls, we're having a revolution today....Everybody grab your favorite shotgun"? It doesn't quite work that way but there is one commonality.....the rebels are armed from the beginning and although they may be poorly armed at first, circumstances change. Weapons are upgraded, tactics are used that play to the strengths of the rebel forces. I don't think you fully appreciate how easy it is for a determined group to achieve access to paramilitary weaponry and equipment. It's happening right under our noses all over the globe. Do you think National Guard Armory's in the US are what most security professionals would consider a "hard target"????? :laugh3: Do you have any idea how much equipment and weaponry is ripe for the taking in those weekend warrior, buffoon guarded places?



Everything is not always as it seems; everything is not Canada out there.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: asal on August 14, 2015, 07:18:09 PM
Related:  States with higher gun ownership have more deaths of police officers



//http://mobile.nytimes.com/blogs/well/2015/08/13/states-with-high-gun-ownership-see-more-officers-killed/
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 14, 2015, 07:45:16 PM
Quote from: "Wulf"
Quote from: "RW"Tell me where I'm wrong.


You are wrong in the idea that just because a government has superior weaponry it can't be challenged by an armed populace. Have you NOT been paying attention to what is going on in Syria lately?



I already pointed to the American Revolution but there are tons more recent happenings that point to you being wrong. Take for example the Russian Revolution, the Cuban Revolution, the Vietnam war, Even the Nazi take over of the German Democratic government. How many of those challenges to the established government do you think would have been successful if the revolutionaries were unarmed????? I'll tell you how many......NONE.



Do you think a revolution just happens overnight? Do you think that one day an ass load of malcontents just get out of bed and say..."Okay boys and girls, we're having a revolution today....Everybody grab your favorite shotgun"? It doesn't quite work that way but there is one commonality.....the rebels are armed from the beginning and although they may be poorly armed at first, circumstances change. Weapons are upgraded, tactics are used that play to the strengths of the rebel forces. I don't think you fully appreciate how easy it is for a determined group to achieve access to paramilitary weaponry and equipment. It's happening right under our noses all over the globe. Do you think National Guard Armory's in the US are what most security professionals would consider a "hard target"????? :laugh3: Do you have any idea how much equipment and weaponry is ripe for the taking in those weekend warrior, buffoon guarded places?



Everything is not always as it seems; everything is not Canada out there.

Getting back to reality...



Do you really think that would happen in the U.S. and that any violent insurgence wouldn't be immediately squashed by the big bad state?



We're not talking about Syria or Russia.  We are talking about the "democratically" ruled U S of A.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 14, 2015, 09:44:20 PM
Quote from: "Wulf"
Quote from: "RW"Tell me where I'm wrong.


You are wrong in the idea that just because a government has superior weaponry it can't be challenged by an armed populace. Have you NOT been paying attention to what is going on in Syria lately?



I already pointed to the American Revolution but there are tons more recent happenings that point to you being wrong. Take for example the Russian Revolution, the Cuban Revolution, the Vietnam war, Even the Nazi take over of the German Democratic government. How many of those challenges to the established government do you think would have been successful if the revolutionaries were unarmed????? I'll tell you how many......NONE.



Do you think a revolution just happens overnight? Do you think that one day an ass load of malcontents just get out of bed and say..."Okay boys and girls, we're having a revolution today....Everybody grab your favorite shotgun"? It doesn't quite work that way but there is one commonality.....the rebels are armed from the beginning and although they may be poorly armed at first, circumstances change. Weapons are upgraded, tactics are used that play to the strengths of the rebel forces. I don't think you fully appreciate how easy it is for a determined group to achieve access to paramilitary weaponry and equipment. It's happening right under our noses all over the globe. Do you think National Guard Armory's in the US are what most security professionals would consider a "hard target"????? :laugh3: Do you have any idea how much equipment and weaponry is ripe for the taking in those weekend warrior, buffoon guarded places?



Everything is not always as it seems; everything is not Canada out there.


You need to re-read your history.



The American Revolution was not won by armed citizens; it was won by armed dissidents supported by the French and Spanish military, over a stretched and weary British force.



The Russian, French, Cuban and Vietnamese revolutions all succeeded because the MILITARY turned on the government and sided with the rebellion. That includes the overthrow of the Soviet government when Boris Yeltsin took control. Likewise Romania.



Other revolutions, such as Czechoslovakia, Hungary and Poland failed because the military remained loyal.



The Nazis took power in Germany by peaceful means, having won a number of seats in their Parliament. There was no military force involved.



In Syria and Libya, their rebel forces were commanded and managed by former generals from the Government forces.



Whilst I don't question the "ease" with which rebels can procure weaponry, I would be astonished if you, of all people, would back an armed civil insurrection against a properly equipped and trained military force.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Wulf on August 14, 2015, 10:16:59 PM
Quote from: "RW"
Quote from: "Wulf"
Quote from: "RW"Tell me where I'm wrong.


You are wrong in the idea that just because a government has superior weaponry it can't be challenged by an armed populace. Have you NOT been paying attention to what is going on in Syria lately?



I already pointed to the American Revolution but there are tons more recent happenings that point to you being wrong. Take for example the Russian Revolution, the Cuban Revolution, the Vietnam war, Even the Nazi take over of the German Democratic government. How many of those challenges to the established government do you think would have been successful if the revolutionaries were unarmed????? I'll tell you how many......NONE.



Do you think a revolution just happens overnight? Do you think that one day an ass load of malcontents just get out of bed and say..."Okay boys and girls, we're having a revolution today....Everybody grab your favorite shotgun"? It doesn't quite work that way but there is one commonality.....the rebels are armed from the beginning and although they may be poorly armed at first, circumstances change. Weapons are upgraded, tactics are used that play to the strengths of the rebel forces. I don't think you fully appreciate how easy it is for a determined group to achieve access to paramilitary weaponry and equipment. It's happening right under our noses all over the globe. Do you think National Guard Armory's in the US are what most security professionals would consider a "hard target"????? :laugh3: Do you have any idea how much equipment and weaponry is ripe for the taking in those weekend warrior, buffoon guarded places?



Everything is not always as it seems; everything is not Canada out there.

Getting back to reality...



Do you really think that would happen in the U.S. and that any violent insurgence wouldn't be immediately squashed by the big bad state?



We're not talking about Syria or Russia.  We are talking about the "democratically" ruled U S of A.


Is that it? That's what you are honestly going to use to support your opinion based assertion?  :laugh3: I feel cheated.



It's funny how so many people that have never been any where near an armed conflict are so knowledgeable in military matters. Please feel free to elaborate your position.....I'm still waiting for the entertainment to start.  :laugh3:
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 14, 2015, 10:28:16 PM
When you purchase a gun Wulf is the reason "in case the government gets out of hand"?  How many Anericans would you say buy a gun for that purpose?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Wulf on August 14, 2015, 11:40:20 PM
Quote from: "SPECTRE"
Quote from: "Wulf"
Quote from: "RW"Tell me where I'm wrong.


You are wrong in the idea that just because a government has superior weaponry it can't be challenged by an armed populace. Have you NOT been paying attention to what is going on in Syria lately?



I already pointed to the American Revolution but there are tons more recent happenings that point to you being wrong. Take for example the Russian Revolution, the Cuban Revolution, the Vietnam war, Even the Nazi take over of the German Democratic government. How many of those challenges to the established government do you think would have been successful if the revolutionaries were unarmed????? I'll tell you how many......NONE.



Do you think a revolution just happens overnight? Do you think that one day an ass load of malcontents just get out of bed and say..."Okay boys and girls, we're having a revolution today....Everybody grab your favorite shotgun"? It doesn't quite work that way but there is one commonality.....the rebels are armed from the beginning and although they may be poorly armed at first, circumstances change. Weapons are upgraded, tactics are used that play to the strengths of the rebel forces. I don't think you fully appreciate how easy it is for a determined group to achieve access to paramilitary weaponry and equipment. It's happening right under our noses all over the globe. Do you think National Guard Armory's in the US are what most security professionals would consider a "hard target"????? :laugh3: Do you have any idea how much equipment and weaponry is ripe for the taking in those weekend warrior, buffoon guarded places?



Everything is not always as it seems; everything is not Canada out there.


You need to re-read your history.



The American Revolution was not won by armed citizens; it was won by armed dissidents supported by the French and Spanish military, over a stretched and weary British force.



The Russian, French, Cuban and Vietnamese revolutions all succeeded because the MILITARY turned on the government and sided with the rebellion. That includes the overthrow of the Soviet government when Boris Yeltsin took control. Likewise Romania.



Other revolutions, such as Czechoslovakia, Hungary and Poland failed because the military remained loyal.



The Nazis took power in Germany by peaceful means, having won a number of seats in their Parliament. There was no military force involved.



In Syria and Libya, their rebel forces were commanded and managed by former generals from the Government forces.



Whilst I don't question the "ease" with which rebels can procure weaponry, I would be astonished if you, of all people, would back an armed civil insurrection against a properly equipped and trained military force.


Do you think the US military would remain 100% loyal if the cause the people had was seen as just. Despite what you think you know, you don't really understand the American psyche nor the mission and temperament of its military. I think I know it a little better than you or anyone here.



Just so you know the US currently has a significant number of veterans living as private citizens who would more than be ready to answer a call to arms should it ever come to an extreme and unthinkable situation. Why you would be astonished as to my position on this I cannot fathom. First an foremost I am a citizen of the US and should our government ever forget that they exist to serve the people I would be more than willing to remind them of their place be it at the voting booth or on a field of fire. Just about anyone who serves or has served in the US military feels the same way. Who do you think the average US soldier owes his allegiance to....the government????? Fuck no, it's to the people. We take an oath to protect the country and we owe or loyalty to the principals that founded this nation, not the politicians in Washington. Just as the politicians are supposed to serve the people so is the military.



BTW, who do you think those "armed dissidents" were during the American Revolution? They were American citizens.

As to your assertion that the Nazis took control of Germany by peaceful means, all I can say is you have obviously skipped over the "Night of the Longknives" and the events leading up to it. You also seem to be unaware that there was a paramilitary arm of the Nazi party (Brownshirts). Their sole purpose was to foceibly subdue the political opposition through violent means. If you can find a living member of the communist party that existed in Germany in 1934 YOU could ask him or her if the Nazis took control peaceably. In 1934, I think all in total there were about 4000 commies arrested, and hundreds killed in fighting against the Nazis. Does that sound like taking control by peaceful means?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Wulf on August 14, 2015, 11:48:16 PM
Quote from: "RW"When you purchase a gun Wulf is the reason "in case the government gets out of hand"?  How many Anericans would you say buy a gun for that purpose?


Guns are tools and can be used for a variety of purposes. I don't know exactly why people buy them. I suppose everyone has their own reasons.



Look at it this way, how many people purchase a hammer with the idea that it will come in handy if their house blows down during a hurricane? ac_dunno I don't think a hell of a lot of "do it yourselfers" are buying hammers and power tools so that they an reconstruct their homes in the event of a natural disaster but it would sure be nice to have them if they are needed.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Romero on August 15, 2015, 12:38:59 AM
Not only do I keep a hammer in my home, I also open carry a hammer. You never know when there's going to be a hurricane or someone with another hammer.



Gotta have a hammer in case the government comes after us with their hammers.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Romero on August 15, 2015, 12:54:00 AM
Quote from: "Wulf"Just so you know the US currently has a significant number of veterans living as private citizens who would more than be ready to answer a call to arms should it ever come to an extreme and unthinkable situation. Why you would be astonished as to my position on this I cannot fathom. First an foremost I am a citizen of the US and should our government ever forget that they exist to serve the people I would be more than willing to remind them of their place be it at the voting booth or on a field of fire. Just about anyone who serves or has served in the US military feels the same way. Who do you think the average US soldier owes his allegiance to....the government????? Fuck no, it's to the people. We take an oath to protect the country and we owe or loyalty to the principals that founded this nation, not the politicians in Washington. Just as the politicians are supposed to serve the people so is the military.

You're so naive.



The US government "War on Terror" alone has killed over 6,000 American soldiers. Hundreds of thousands of American casualties, suicides, PTSD, brain damaged and depressed.



One hundred thousand veterans are currently unemployed and homeless on any given day. Veteran Affairs is a cruel joke. Families are being ruined.



And to think, with all these hundreds of thousands of lives already ruined, you're more worried about some stupid conspiracy theory that hasn't even happened.



You've been for the Iraq war, haven't you? You're a government stooge. A traitor to the veterans who were harmed because of your ideology.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: J0E on August 15, 2015, 12:55:54 AM
why did the killer murder all those people?



Did this have anything to do with being denied access to see his kids?



Certainly revenge on his ex must've been one of the main motivators.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Wulf on August 15, 2015, 01:15:13 AM
Quote from: "Romero"Not only do I keep a hammer in my home, I also open carry a hammer. You never know when there's going to be a hurricane or someone with another hammer.



Gotta have a hammer in case the government comes after us with their hammers.


You don't need a hammer. Domestic violence statistics say that you are 4 times more likely to beat your boyfriend with it than drive a nail.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Wulf on August 15, 2015, 01:58:58 AM
Quote from: "Romero"
Quote from: "Wulf"Just so you know the US currently has a significant number of veterans living as private citizens who would more than be ready to answer a call to arms should it ever come to an extreme and unthinkable situation. Why you would be astonished as to my position on this I cannot fathom. First an foremost I am a citizen of the US and should our government ever forget that they exist to serve the people I would be more than willing to remind them of their place be it at the voting booth or on a field of fire. Just about anyone who serves or has served in the US military feels the same way. Who do you think the average US soldier owes his allegiance to....the government????? Fuck no, it's to the people. We take an oath to protect the country and we owe or loyalty to the principals that founded this nation, not the politicians in Washington. Just as the politicians are supposed to serve the people so is the military.

You're so naive.



The US government "War on Terror" alone has killed over 6,000 American soldiers. Hundreds of thousands of American casualties, suicides, PTSD, brain damaged and depressed.



One hundred thousand veterans are currently unemployed and homeless on any given day. Veteran Affairs is a cruel joke. Families are being ruined.



And to think, with all these hundreds of thousands of lives already ruined, you're more worried about some stupid conspiracy theory that hasn't even happened.



You've been for the Iraq war, haven't you? You're a government stooge. A traitor to the veterans who were harmed because of your ideology.


What the he'll are you raving about? You are a far left loon with a lot more to say about shit that doesn't concern you than anyone has a RIGHT to.



Don't fucking tell me about the plight of US veterans or the sacrifices they have made. I wouldn't expect a feminized, mealy mouthed, little douch like you to understand  why we do what we do. The sacrifices they have made were done willingly and dispite that the gov has let them down it doesn't change the fact that most of them would give the same of themselves again if they could. But you probably wouldn't know anything about that because the Huffington Post left that bit of info out of their last op-ed piece.



 It's a sad fact that vets have not been given the attention and treatment they deserve but it doesn't give you the right to use your cowardly cake hole to speak for them or lecture me about their condition. Who the hell are you but a little Canadian shit heel who has never given anything  of himself that didn't contribute to his own personal comfort.



Tell me you leftist creep, if this were a face to face convo would you have the same courage to spout off like the rainbow flag waving, crusader you desperately want to be? Or does all that mouth come from the relative protection of distance and keyboard?



BTW shithead, the only person here worried about anything is obviously you. It's evident by the way you flew in hysterically waving you fairy wings around like a little bitch over a discussion regarding a political event that is theoretical in nature. Get a grip for Christ sake. Well at least you didn't liken me to Hitler but I'm sure that's coming up next.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 15, 2015, 03:03:50 AM
Quote from: "Wulf"


Do you think the US military would remain 100% loyal if the cause the people had was seen as just. Despite what you think you know, you don't really understand the American psyche nor the mission and temperament of its military. I think I know it a little better than you or anyone here.



Just so you know the US currently has a significant number of veterans living as private citizens who would more than be ready to answer a call to arms should it ever come to an extreme and unthinkable situation. Why you would be astonished as to my position on this I cannot fathom. First an foremost I am a citizen of the US and should our government ever forget that they exist to serve the people I would be more than willing to remind them of their place be it at the voting booth or on a field of fire. Just about anyone who serves or has served in the US military feels the same way. Who do you think the average US soldier owes his allegiance to....the government????? Fuck no, it's to the people. We take an oath to protect the country and we owe or loyalty to the principals that founded this nation, not the politicians in Washington. Just as the politicians are supposed to serve the people so is the military.



BTW, who do you think those "armed dissidents" were during the American Revolution? They were American citizens.

As to your assertion that the Nazis took control of Germany by peaceful means, all I can say is you have obviously skipped over the "Night of the Longknives" and the events leading up to it. You also seem to be unaware that there was a paramilitary arm of the Nazi party (Brownshirts). Their sole purpose was to foceibly subdue the political opposition through violent means. If you can find a living member of the communist party that existed in Germany in 1934 YOU could ask him or her if the Nazis took control peaceably. In 1934, I think all in total there were about 4000 commies arrested, and hundreds killed in fighting against the Nazis. Does that sound like taking control by peaceful means?


I would not pretend to know where your military's allegiance would lie in the case of major civil unrest and national rebellion. I defer to your greater knowledge in that regard.



The point I'm making is that if the military stays loyal to the government, then all the armed civilians in the US would not succeed in overthrowing the politicians.



And politicians know that...which is why they appoint and monitor their generals very, very carefully. As they do everywhere.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 15, 2015, 06:27:40 AM
Quote from: "Wulf"
Quote from: "RW"
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
Quote from: "Dove"You really have no idea what America is really like. The only thing that keeps the businesses safe in the city I live in is the right the owners have to arm themselves.  We need to deal with poverty and the illegal fire arms that FAR out number the legal ones. Not strip rights away from noncriminals.  That's like saying the way to stop the heroin epidemic is to take pain patients prescriptions away. It makes no sense and doesn't address the problem.  You don't strip rights from innocent people in order to clean up criminals.


Most Australians don't understand America and its background nor do they want to understand it because we here are indoctrinated otherwise by our politicians and mass media.



You're not going to get anywhere with him on this topic especially so if he was actually a cop. The idea that people could defend themselves against their government and their uniformed officers or soldiers scares the shit out of them and Australia has a very dicey history in that regard.

The American government has tanks and fighter jets and shit.  WTF are guns against that?  LOL!  Fight back against the government.  That's ridiculous.



Get with the times.


And it's troops have to have the willingness to turn those weapons on their own people, ......family/friends. Not going to happen.



Get with reality.


Such polls of US military personnel happen from time to time and the indications are towards progressively following orders before following consciences. Much like the stand downs and subsequent career assassinations which happened within AFRICOM during Christpher Steven's death in a satellite compound for CIA weapons bazaar, the US military is abruptly shaved where any stubble on policy might arise.


QuoteI want to remind you that throughout history governments have ALWAYS been better equipped than the revolutionaries.That has not always been the deciding factor in a violent struggle for change.


Agreed.


QuoteThe US itself is living proof of that. Canadians and Aussies will never understand because your national psyche was and it think still is, one of ambivalence when it comes to your independence. You people got what was left of the tyrant after what we in the US went thru. 18TH century British ego and their overbearing heavy handed style of governing was severely reduced and forever changed after they got humiliated in front of the entire world (TWICE) I might add, by the fledgling US. It was a case where a vastly superior military force learn hard lessons that have been repeated over and over again by governments all over the world.


There's far more to it than just that.


QuoteYour people have never been thru it so it has not shaped or effected your way of thinking.  It's a good thing because if pushed into an untenable position by your governments you are I'll equipped to do anything about it. And unfortunately, you are all too pussified at this point to do more than whine and cry. That sad fact is played out and evident right here on this forum day after day.


You probably don't understand Aussie politics and I dare say know nothing of Australian history. If you'd like to understand better, simply ask Spectre, I, or both (he and I are sure to have different views at any rate).
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: @realAzhyaAryola on August 15, 2015, 09:03:14 AM
Quote from: "Wulf"
"Pessimist"?????......No, "realist" the proper term. But I am grumpy, I'll give you that.



I say you are wrong. I have history and military experience and tactical knowledge on my side, what do you have...Opinion? last I checked opinion is not good enough to prove a point.


Opinion. I've noticed this in the forums. There's just too many opinions pouring in from every direction yet, these are just opinions. If someone's got such a profound opinion on how to change the world or the community, what are they doing crusading for their opinions in an internet forum? They should go out there and change what they want to change based on their opinions. Their opinions are withering away in an internet archive to be erased by one mere click. If it were that "great," I hope they would apply it out there in the real world and let's see them, their opinions, and their names hot off the press in the morning paper.



Sometimes, I'm in a hurry to go somewhere and then I find myself delayed because I'm reading someone's lengthy post and then I ask myself, "Why am I reading this!?"



Fall out.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Wulf on August 15, 2015, 09:24:30 AM
Quote from: "SPECTRE"
Quote from: "Wulf"


Do you think the US military would remain 100% loyal if the cause the people had was seen as just. Despite what you think you know, you don't really understand the American psyche nor the mission and temperament of its military. I think I know it a little better than you or anyone here.



Just so you know the US currently has a significant number of veterans living as private citizens who would more than be ready to answer a call to arms should it ever come to an extreme and unthinkable situation. Why you would be astonished as to my position on this I cannot fathom. First an foremost I am a citizen of the US and should our government ever forget that they exist to serve the people I would be more than willing to remind them of their place be it at the voting booth or on a field of fire. Just about anyone who serves or has served in the US military feels the same way. Who do you think the average US soldier owes his allegiance to....the government????? Fuck no, it's to the people. We take an oath to protect the country and we owe or loyalty to the principals that founded this nation, not the politicians in Washington. Just as the politicians are supposed to serve the people so is the military.



BTW, who do you think those "armed dissidents" were during the American Revolution? They were American citizens.

As to your assertion that the Nazis took control of Germany by peaceful means, all I can say is you have obviously skipped over the "Night of the Longknives" and the events leading up to it. You also seem to be unaware that there was a paramilitary arm of the Nazi party (Brownshirts). Their sole purpose was to forcibly subdue the political opposition through violent means. If you can find a living member of the communist party that existed in Germany in 1934 YOU could ask him or her if the Nazis took control peaceably. In 1934, I think all in total there were about 4000 commies arrested, and hundreds killed in fighting against the Nazis. Does that sound like taking control by peaceful means?


I would not pretend to know where your military's allegiance would lie in the case of major civil unrest and national rebellion. I defer to your greater knowledge in that regard.



The point I'm making is that if the military stays loyal to the government, then all the armed civilians in the US would not succeed in overthrowing the politicians.



And politicians know that...which is why they appoint and monitor their generals very, very carefully. As they do everywhere.


Agreed but remember, Generals are only as good as their chain of command. Those who work for them have to believe in what they are doing is right. I can only point to the American Civil War when the best of the best commanders went over to the rebels because they felt their allegiance to a principle took precedence over their allegiance to what they felt was a tyrannical central government.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Wulf on August 15, 2015, 09:25:56 AM
edit double
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 15, 2015, 10:09:01 AM
Quote from: "Wulf"
Quote from: "SPECTRE"
Quote from: "Wulf"


Do you think the US military would remain 100% loyal if the cause the people had was seen as just. Despite what you think you know, you don't really understand the American psyche nor the mission and temperament of its military. I think I know it a little better than you or anyone here.



Just so you know the US currently has a significant number of veterans living as private citizens who would more than be ready to answer a call to arms should it ever come to an extreme and unthinkable situation. Why you would be astonished as to my position on this I cannot fathom. First an foremost I am a citizen of the US and should our government ever forget that they exist to serve the people I would be more than willing to remind them of their place be it at the voting booth or on a field of fire. Just about anyone who serves or has served in the US military feels the same way. Who do you think the average US soldier owes his allegiance to....the government????? Fuck no, it's to the people. We take an oath to protect the country and we owe or loyalty to the principals that founded this nation, not the politicians in Washington. Just as the politicians are supposed to serve the people so is the military.



BTW, who do you think those "armed dissidents" were during the American Revolution? They were American citizens.

As to your assertion that the Nazis took control of Germany by peaceful means, all I can say is you have obviously skipped over the "Night of the Longknives" and the events leading up to it. You also seem to be unaware that there was a paramilitary arm of the Nazi party (Brownshirts). Their sole purpose was to forcibly subdue the political opposition through violent means. If you can find a living member of the communist party that existed in Germany in 1934 YOU could ask him or her if the Nazis took control peaceably. In 1934, I think all in total there were about 4000 commies arrested, and hundreds killed in fighting against the Nazis. Does that sound like taking control by peaceful means?


I would not pretend to know where your military's allegiance would lie in the case of major civil unrest and national rebellion. I defer to your greater knowledge in that regard.



The point I'm making is that if the military stays loyal to the government, then all the armed civilians in the US would not succeed in overthrowing the politicians.



And politicians know that...which is why they appoint and monitor their generals very, very carefully. As they do everywhere.


Agreed but remember, Generals are only as good as their chain of command. Those who work for them have to believe in what they are doing is right. I can only point to the American Civil War when the best of the best commanders went over to the rebels because they felt their allegiance to a principle took precedence over their allegiance to what they felt was a tyrannical central government.


Um, your history books dictate that the best of the best (or West Point graduates) were Southern born and raised.



Are you reading from the Northern Revisionist School Textbook?



Do you also believe that the North abolished the horrible institution of negro slavery by the Emancipation Proclamation and what are your feelings on the eventual Posse Comitatus Act?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 15, 2015, 12:06:31 PM
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
Quote from: "Dove"You really have no idea what America is really like. The only thing that keeps the businesses safe in the city I live in is the right the owners have to arm themselves.  We need to deal with poverty and the illegal fire arms that FAR out number the legal ones. Not strip rights away from noncriminals.  That's like saying the way to stop the heroin epidemic is to take pain patients prescriptions away. It makes no sense and doesn't address the problem.  You don't strip rights from innocent people in order to clean up criminals.


Most Australians don't understand America and its background nor do they want to understand it because we here are indoctrinated otherwise by our politicians and mass media.



You're not going to get anywhere with him on this topic especially so if he was actually a cop. The idea that people could defend themselves against their government and their uniformed officers or soldiers scares the shit out of them and Australia has a very dicey history in that regard.

 The right to have arms was set in place for that purpose. To protect our Constitution against government tyranny.  We need it now more than ever because it's gonna hit the fan in a big way over here. Our entire system is corrupt.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 15, 2015, 12:11:09 PM
Quote from: "RW"When you purchase a gun Wulf is the reason "in case the government gets out of hand"?  How many Anericans would you say buy a gun for that purpose?

 Several thousand nationwide.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 15, 2015, 12:55:09 PM
Quote from: "Dove"
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
Quote from: "Dove"You really have no idea what America is really like. The only thing that keeps the businesses safe in the city I live in is the right the owners have to arm themselves.  We need to deal with poverty and the illegal fire arms that FAR out number the legal ones. Not strip rights away from noncriminals.  That's like saying the way to stop the heroin epidemic is to take pain patients prescriptions away. It makes no sense and doesn't address the problem.  You don't strip rights from innocent people in order to clean up criminals.


Most Australians don't understand America and its background nor do they want to understand it because we here are indoctrinated otherwise by our politicians and mass media.



You're not going to get anywhere with him on this topic especially so if he was actually a cop. The idea that people could defend themselves against their government and their uniformed officers or soldiers scares the shit out of them and Australia has a very dicey history in that regard.

 The right to have arms was set in place for that purpose. To protect our Constitution against government tyranny.  We need it now more than ever because it's gonna hit the fan in a big way over here. Our entire system is corrupt.


You'll have to go it alone it that regard, Dove.



Australia, New Zealand, Canada, and above all what's left of the Commonwealth all around the English speaking world believe that the only way to challenge gross injustice is to "democratically" submit a vote (more often than not compulsory) if and where it's allowed by government mandate, and that's somehow more civilized than not molesting each other with touchy or trigger happy fingers.



America is looked at with fear and contempt.



If there is a revolt in America by sane people, the rest of the police state world is scared of having to follow along. They won't stand for it.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 15, 2015, 02:42:04 PM
Quote from: "Dove"
Quote from: "RW"When you purchase a gun Wulf is the reason "in case the government gets out of hand"?  How many Anericans would you say buy a gun for that purpose?

 Several thousand nationwide.

Several thousand nationwide in a country with a population of almost 310 million.  Let me guess, they all still fly the Confederate flag.



 :001_rolleyes:
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 15, 2015, 02:54:54 PM
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
Quote from: "Dove"
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
Quote from: "Dove"You really have no idea what America is really like. The only thing that keeps the businesses safe in the city I live in is the right the owners have to arm themselves.  We need to deal with poverty and the illegal fire arms that FAR out number the legal ones. Not strip rights away from noncriminals.  That's like saying the way to stop the heroin epidemic is to take pain patients prescriptions away. It makes no sense and doesn't address the problem.  You don't strip rights from innocent people in order to clean up criminals.


Most Australians don't understand America and its background nor do they want to understand it because we here are indoctrinated otherwise by our politicians and mass media.



You're not going to get anywhere with him on this topic especially so if he was actually a cop. The idea that people could defend themselves against their government and their uniformed officers or soldiers scares the shit out of them and Australia has a very dicey history in that regard.

 The right to have arms was set in place for that purpose. To protect our Constitution against government tyranny.  We need it now more than ever because it's gonna hit the fan in a big way over here. Our entire system is corrupt.


You'll have to go it alone it that regard, Dove.



Australia, New Zealand, Canada, and above all what's left of the Commonwealth all around the English speaking world believe that the only way to challenge gross injustice is to "democratically" submit a vote (more often than not compulsory) if and where it's allowed by government mandate, and that's somehow more civilized than not molesting each other with touchy or trigger happy fingers.



America is looked at with fear and contempt.



If there is a revolt in America by sane people, the rest of the police state world is scared of having to follow along. They won't stand for it.

I think more pity than contempt.  I feel sorry for any society that lives in so much fear.  I couldn't imagine living in a country where I felt I needed a gun to keep the government in line.  I can't fathom that even being a realistic option.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 15, 2015, 03:16:05 PM
Quote from: "Azhya Aryola"
Quote from: "Wulf"
"Pessimist"?????......No, "realist" the proper term. But I am grumpy, I'll give you that.



I say you are wrong. I have history and military experience and tactical knowledge on my side, what do you have...Opinion? last I checked opinion is not good enough to prove a point.


Opinion. I've noticed this in the forums. There's just too many opinions pouring in from every direction yet, these are just opinions. If someone's got such a profound opinion on how to change the world or the community, what are they doing crusading for their opinions in an internet forum? They should go out there and change what they want to change based on their opinions. Their opinions are withering away in an internet archive to be erased by one mere click. If it were that "great," I hope they would apply it out there in the real world and let's see them, their opinions, and their names hot off the press in the morning paper.



Sometimes, I'm in a hurry to go somewhere and then I find myself delayed because I'm reading someone's lengthy post and then I ask myself, "Why am I reading this!?"



Fall out.

When you have a discussion by the water cooler Az, do you ask why they are bothering to even talk to each other?  It's people talking.  What's wrong with that?



And just to qualify things, I spent many years changing communities in a volunteer capacity.  The hours I spent "making a difference" would make your hair curl.  Does that give me the right to have an opinion in your humble one?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 15, 2015, 05:55:27 PM
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
Quote from: "Dove"
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
Quote from: "Dove"You really have no idea what America is really like. The only thing that keeps the businesses safe in the city I live in is the right the owners have to arm themselves.  We need to deal with poverty and the illegal fire arms that FAR out number the legal ones. Not strip rights away from noncriminals.  That's like saying the way to stop the heroin epidemic is to take pain patients prescriptions away. It makes no sense and doesn't address the problem.  You don't strip rights from innocent people in order to clean up criminals.


Most Australians don't understand America and its background nor do they want to understand it because we here are indoctrinated otherwise by our politicians and mass media.



You're not going to get anywhere with him on this topic especially so if he was actually a cop. The idea that people could defend themselves against their government and their uniformed officers or soldiers scares the shit out of them and Australia has a very dicey history in that regard.

 The right to have arms was set in place for that purpose. To protect our Constitution against government tyranny.  We need it now more than ever because it's gonna hit the fan in a big way over here. Our entire system is corrupt.


You'll have to go it alone it that regard, Dove.



Australia, New Zealand, Canada, and above all what's left of the Commonwealth all around the English speaking world believe that the only way to challenge gross injustice is to "democratically" submit a vote (more often than not compulsory) if and where it's allowed by government mandate, and that's somehow more civilized than not molesting each other with touchy or trigger happy fingers.



America is looked at with fear and contempt.



If there is a revolt in America by sane people, the rest of the police state world is scared of having to follow along. They won't stand for it.
  The sane ones who will be revolting aren't nearly as concerned with other countries.  More concern lies with our own government
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 15, 2015, 05:56:56 PM
Quote from: "RW"
Quote from: "Dove"
Quote from: "RW"When you purchase a gun Wulf is the reason "in case the government gets out of hand"?  How many Anericans would you say buy a gun for that purpose?

 Several thousand nationwide.

Several thousand nationwide in a country with a population of almost 310 million.  Let me guess, they all still fly the Confederate flag.



 :001_rolleyes:
  What do you know about the Confederate flag besides what you are told?  Take a trip to the gulf Coast and see all the black people flying it.  It's not a symbol of racism.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 15, 2015, 06:13:04 PM
Quote from: "Dove"
Quote from: "RW"
Quote from: "Dove"
Quote from: "RW"When you purchase a gun Wulf is the reason "in case the government gets out of hand"?  How many Anericans would you say buy a gun for that purpose?

 Several thousand nationwide.

Several thousand nationwide in a country with a population of almost 310 million.  Let me guess, they all still fly the Confederate flag.



 :001_rolleyes:
  What do you know about the Confederate flag besides what you are told?  Take a trip to the gulf Coast and see all the black people flying it.  It's not a symbol of racism.

Well luckily I didn't say fuck all about racism, eh?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 15, 2015, 06:13:58 PM
Quote from: "Dove"
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
Quote from: "Dove"
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
Quote from: "Dove"You really have no idea what America is really like. The only thing that keeps the businesses safe in the city I live in is the right the owners have to arm themselves.  We need to deal with poverty and the illegal fire arms that FAR out number the legal ones. Not strip rights away from noncriminals.  That's like saying the way to stop the heroin epidemic is to take pain patients prescriptions away. It makes no sense and doesn't address the problem.  You don't strip rights from innocent people in order to clean up criminals.


Most Australians don't understand America and its background nor do they want to understand it because we here are indoctrinated otherwise by our politicians and mass media.



You're not going to get anywhere with him on this topic especially so if he was actually a cop. The idea that people could defend themselves against their government and their uniformed officers or soldiers scares the shit out of them and Australia has a very dicey history in that regard.

 The right to have arms was set in place for that purpose. To protect our Constitution against government tyranny.  We need it now more than ever because it's gonna hit the fan in a big way over here. Our entire system is corrupt.


You'll have to go it alone it that regard, Dove.



Australia, New Zealand, Canada, and above all what's left of the Commonwealth all around the English speaking world believe that the only way to challenge gross injustice is to "democratically" submit a vote (more often than not compulsory) if and where it's allowed by government mandate, and that's somehow more civilized than not molesting each other with touchy or trigger happy fingers.



America is looked at with fear and contempt.



If there is a revolt in America by sane people, the rest of the police state world is scared of having to follow along. They won't stand for it.
  The sane ones who will be revolting aren't nearly as concerned with other countries.  More concern lies with our own government

The sane ones who will be revolting?



BUAHAHAHA.  :laugh3:
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 15, 2015, 10:43:07 PM
Yes, thousands organize in protest. Why are you getting shitty about it?  You think people should fork over our rights to our corrupt government?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 15, 2015, 10:48:35 PM
Quote from: "Dove"Yes, thousands organize in protest. Why are you getting shitty about it?  You think people should fork over our rights to our corrupt government?

I think you're saying ridiculous things.



It's funny.  I live in a country where I'm not afraid of my government.  Why are you so paranoid?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 15, 2015, 11:22:18 PM
So you assume the whole world works out like canada. Do you know what goes on in america? It may sound ridiculous to you....but you don't live here

  You can get pulled over by your mounted police without dying.  That's just one example. My state is a huge Hotspot for human trafficking, and the last mayor of Detroit put a good amount of strippers at the bottom of the river.  Paranoid?  Do you want a list? We have isis, in a country whose government embraces Islam.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: asal on August 16, 2015, 12:15:49 AM
Looks like a country where the citizens embrace conspiracy theories.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 16, 2015, 12:44:21 AM
Quote from: "asal"Looks like a country where the citizens embrace conspiracy theories.

 :thumbup:
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 16, 2015, 01:36:13 AM
http://mobile.nytimes.com/2013/10/11/us/former-detroit-mayor-kwame-kilpatrick-sentencing.html?referrer=&_r=0
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 16, 2015, 01:37:27 AM
http://www.masoncountypress.com/2015/04/09/human-trafficking-is-real-in-michigan/
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 16, 2015, 01:42:49 AM
http://nationalreport.net/city-michigan-first-fully-implement-sharia-law/
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 16, 2015, 01:46:31 AM
http://www.thurswell.com/blog/police-brutality-possible-abuse-filmed-lincoln-park-michigan/
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 16, 2015, 01:48:06 AM
http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2015/03/25/3639158/3-cops-caught-tape-brutally-beating-unarmed-michigan-man-no-apparent-provocation/
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 16, 2015, 01:50:21 AM
http://fightcps.com/cps/countries/united-states/dhs-michigan/
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: asal on August 16, 2015, 02:50:49 AM
Quote from: "Dove"http://nationalreport.net/city-michigan-first-fully-implement-sharia-law/


//http://michiganradio.org/post/sharia-law-dearborn#stream/0



First line:  
QuoteFor years, there's been an absolutely stupid rumor that the Detroit suburb of Dearborn, birthplace of Henry Ford, is now under extreme Muslim Sharia law.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: asal on August 16, 2015, 03:03:37 AM
Quote from: "Dove"http://www.masoncountypress.com/2015/04/09/human-trafficking-is-real-in-michigan/


Human trafficking is a huge topic to tackle.  The sentence you wrote is that Michigan is a hotspot for human trafficking.  I couldn't find specific comparisons of rates of human trafficking in Michigan to other states.  I don't like to look too hard for these stats. - they might exist.



//http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/5-things-you-didnt-know-about-human-trafficking-20140819
QuoteHuman trafficking is shockingly common around the world.

According to an International Labour Organization report from 2012, a staggering three out of every 1,000 people worldwide are in forced labor. That's nearly 21 million people, including 1.5 million in North America – where the U.S. defines human trafficking as falling into two categories, sex trafficking and labor trafficking, under the Victims of Trafficking and Violence Protection Act passed in 2000.



Read more: http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/5-things-you-didnt-know-about-human-trafficking-20140819#ixzz3ixTfNrJo

Follow us: @rollingstone on Twitter | RollingStone on Facebook
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 16, 2015, 03:13:44 AM
I mean I can post several links, and I'm 30 minutes from dearborn. We are not "conspiracy theorists". We rank #2 in human trafficking as well. A few girls in the mission escaped from sex trade. They are working with the fbi on the methods used by traffickers.  In the city I live in, we have over 500 registered sex offenders....so, I'm not down with forking over my right to arms to a government that protects criminals.  I'm a very peaceful person and I'm against taking life, but if I need to blow out a knee cap in order to protect my little girls, I'm gonna do it. We need to solve the crime and poverty issue. Stripping rights from non criminals will not do that and frankly, Americans are too rightfully spooked to go for that.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 16, 2015, 08:11:31 PM
It is clearly established that you possessing a gun will not prevent crime. It is a misconception. Despite your massive aresenal of guns in private hands, your crime rate is comparable with most other western nations, higher than some, lower than others.



The problem is fear.



America is a nation built on fear. It fears its own citizens. It fears its own Government. It fears other nations. Having a gun in your hand alleviates that fear, at both the individual and national level. But as we've seen on BOTH levels, your military might and private gun ownership has solved nothing, and has created far more problems than solutions.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 16, 2015, 08:16:57 PM
Problem is also lack of fear or distrust in nations with strict rules on weapon ownership. Governments should never be permitted a monopoly on force, or they inevitably start eating up their populace one way or another. A vote is not self defense and it's far from civilized regardless of what some self defense naysayers say otherwise.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 16, 2015, 08:19:19 PM
:2r4ml1j_th:
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 16, 2015, 08:29:58 PM
I never expected that you would understand. Your kind are unlikely to ever bite the hand which has fed you or have a good hard look at your identity and life choices.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 16, 2015, 08:36:09 PM
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"Problem is also lack of fear or distrust in nations with strict rules on weapon ownership. Governments should never be permitted a monopoly on force, or they inevitably start eating up their populace one way or another. A vote is not self defense and it's far from civilized regardless of what some self defense naysayers say otherwise.

So it's weird that we don't fear our government is going to use force on us?  Do you mistake us for a bunch of do-nothings should the government get out of line?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 16, 2015, 08:39:34 PM
No ability to defend yourselves means you've got little option when government inevitably goes bad and starts sacrificing lives and livelihoods to maintain their authority, RW.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 16, 2015, 08:43:08 PM
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"No ability to defend yourselves means you've got little option when government inevitably goes bad and starts sacrificing lives and livelihoods to maintain their authority, RW.


 ac_lmfao



You really are a pathetic little muppet.


Quotewhen government inevitably goes bad


When's the last time a modern democratic government in a free and fair country went "bad"?



Are you referencing Syria? Libya perhaps? Iraq?



No...wait...Ukraine!!
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 16, 2015, 08:44:35 PM
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"I never expected that you would understand. Your kind are unlikely to ever bite the hand which has fed you or have a good hard look at your identity and life choices.


Yeah, my government has treated me appallingly. Even if I ceased working for it in 2001, and worked in the private sector ever since.





What's MY kind again?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 16, 2015, 08:46:47 PM
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"No ability to defend yourselves means you've got little option when government inevitably goes bad and starts sacrificing lives and livelihoods to maintain their authority, RW.

But you are bringing a peashooter to a cannon fight.  Does that not sink in at some point?



We aren't without the ability to defend ourselves.  You see us having strict gun laws as meaning we can't protect ourselves.  We use things called BRAINS up north.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: @realAzhyaAryola on August 16, 2015, 08:47:17 PM
So far, I am grateful to my government so I am not afraid of it nor am I resentful of it.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 16, 2015, 08:50:25 PM
Quote from: "Azhya Aryola"So far, I am grateful to my government so I am not afraid of it nor am I resentful of it.

Do you own a gun?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 16, 2015, 08:51:30 PM
Quote from: "RW"
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"No ability to defend yourselves means you've got little option when government inevitably goes bad and starts sacrificing lives and livelihoods to maintain their authority, RW.

But you are bringing a peashooter to a cannon fight.  Does that not sink in at some point?



We aren't without the ability to defend ourselves.  You see us having strict gun laws as meaning we can't protect ourselves.  We use things called BRAINS up north.


Scuse me.



Please do not judge the intellectually capacity of we in the South by the imbecilic and vacuous blurting of this vapid schlemiel. He is about as representative of Australians as Justin Bieber is of musicians.



Oh, he's Canadian,isn't he?
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 16, 2015, 08:58:10 PM
Quote from: "SPECTRE"
Quote from: "RW"
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"No ability to defend yourselves means you've got little option when government inevitably goes bad and starts sacrificing lives and livelihoods to maintain their authority, RW.

But you are bringing a peashooter to a cannon fight.  Does that not sink in at some point?



We aren't without the ability to defend ourselves.  You see us having strict gun laws as meaning we can't protect ourselves.  We use things called BRAINS up north.


Scuse me.



Please do not judge the intellectually capacity of we in the South by the imbecilic and vacuous blurting of this vapid schlemiel. He is about as representative of Australians as Justin Bieber is of musicians.



Oh, he's Canadian,isn't he?

Sorry, I say "you" as if he was speaking for/as Americans.  I meant north of the USA.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: @realAzhyaAryola on August 16, 2015, 09:04:10 PM
Quote from: "RW"Do you own a gun?


I'm just saying whether or not I own one.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 16, 2015, 09:07:36 PM
Quote from: "Azhya Aryola"
Quote from: "RW"Do you own a gun?


I'm just saying whether or not I own one.

I'm just curious if you don't own one because you're not paranoid of your government or if you have one for other reasons.



It's all good.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 16, 2015, 09:11:58 PM
Quote from: "SPECTRE"
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"No ability to defend yourselves means you've got little option when government inevitably goes bad and starts sacrificing lives and livelihoods to maintain their authority, RW.


 ac_lmfao



You really are a pathetic little muppet.


From you, that's a fine compliment.  ac_smile


Quote from: "Spectre"
Quotewhen government inevitably goes bad


When's the last time a modern democratic government in a free and fair country went "bad"?



Are you referencing Syria? Libya perhaps? Iraq?



No...wait...Ukraine!!


Democide has always happened in both Authoritarian and so called Democratic nations. Hundreds of millions just in the last century for instance. You might want to quibble about what constitutes a free and fair country or whether democracy is marker for it but I'm not interested. Democracy by nature is authoritarian and the underhanded and bloodied efforts of certain Western nations plus complicit partners into Syria, Libya, Iraq, Ukraine and many other nations doesn't absolve them because it happened somewhere else and was not an outright cull or roundup on home soils.



All governments collapse
Quote from: "SPECTRE"
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"I never expected that you would understand. Your kind are unlikely to ever bite the hand which has fed you or have a good hard look at your identity and life choices.






What's MY kind again?
.



Government toadie.


Quote from: "RW"
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"No ability to defend yourselves means you've got little option when government inevitably goes bad and starts sacrificing lives and livelihoods to maintain their authority, RW.

But you are bringing a peashooter to a cannon fight.  Does that not sink in at some point?



We aren't without the ability to defend ourselves.  You see us having strict gun laws as meaning we can't protect ourselves.  We use things called BRAINS up north.


Do you catapult or sling shot them?  ac_smile
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 16, 2015, 09:15:15 PM
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
Quote from: "SPECTRE"
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"No ability to defend yourselves means you've got little option when government inevitably goes bad and starts sacrificing lives and livelihoods to maintain their authority, RW.


 ac_lmfao



You really are a pathetic little muppet.


From you, that's a fine compliment.  ac_smile


Quote from: "Spectre"
Quotewhen government inevitably goes bad


When's the last time a modern democratic government in a free and fair country went "bad"?



Are you referencing Syria? Libya perhaps? Iraq?



No...wait...Ukraine!!


Democide has always happened in both Authoritarian and so called Democratic nations. Hundreds of millions just in the last century for instance. You might want to quibble about what constitutes a free and fair country or whether democracy is marker for it but I'm not interested. Democracy by nature is authoritarian and the underhanded and bloodied efforts of certain Western nations plus complicit partners into Syria, Libya, Iraq, Ukraine and many other nations doesn't absolve them because it happened somewhere else and was not an outright cull or roundup on home soils.



All governments collapse
Quote from: "SPECTRE"
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"I never expected that you would understand. Your kind are unlikely to ever bite the hand which has fed you or have a good hard look at your identity and life choices.






What's MY kind again?
.



Government toadie.


Quote from: "RW"
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"No ability to defend yourselves means you've got little option when government inevitably goes bad and starts sacrificing lives and livelihoods to maintain their authority, RW.

But you are bringing a peashooter to a cannon fight.  Does that not sink in at some point?



We aren't without the ability to defend ourselves.  You see us having strict gun laws as meaning we can't protect ourselves.  We use things called BRAINS up north.


Do you catapult or sling shot them?  ac_smile

No, that's what Americans do.  I just said that.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 16, 2015, 09:35:58 PM
Liar. Americans don't have brains. They have doughnut batter.  ac_smile
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 16, 2015, 10:47:03 PM
Well, another lesson learned.



Donut batter is a better thought processing medium than Dinky's brain.



Stay out of Krispy Kreme, Dinks...you'll end up arguing with a Chocolate Cream over the merits of the hole.



(//%3C/s%3E%3CURL%20url=%22http://www.ineeddonuts.co.uk/uploads/2/0/9/1/20914560/932377.jpg?323%22%3E%3CLINK_TEXT%20text=%22http://www.ineeddonuts.co.uk/uploads/2/%20...%2077.jpg?323%22%3Ehttp://www.ineeddonuts.co.uk/uploads/2/0/9/1/20914560/932377.jpg?323%3C/LINK_TEXT%3E%3C/URL%3E%3Ce%3E)
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: asal on August 16, 2015, 11:10:30 PM
Quote from: "SPECTRE"Well, another lesson learned.



Donut batter is a better thought processing medium than Dinky's brain.



Stay out of Krispy Kreme, Dinks...you'll end up arguing with a Chocolate Cream over the merits of the hole.



(//%3C/s%3E%3CURL%20url=%22http://www.ineeddonuts.co.uk/uploads/2/0/9/1/20914560/932377.jpg?323%22%3E%3CLINK_TEXT%20text=%22http://www.ineeddonuts.co.uk/uploads/2/%20...%2077.jpg?323%22%3Ehttp://www.ineeddonuts.co.uk/uploads/2/0/9/1/20914560/932377.jpg?323%3C/LINK_TEXT%3E%3C/URL%3E%3Ce%3E)


We aren't talking about abortions in this thread.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 17, 2015, 12:20:16 AM
Quote from: "SPECTRE"Well, another lesson learned.



Donut batter is a better thought processing medium than Dinky's brain.



Stay out of Krispy Kreme, Dinks...you'll end up arguing with a Chocolate Cream over the merits of the hole.



(//%3C/s%3E%3CURL%20url=%22http://www.ineeddonuts.co.uk/uploads/2/0/9/1/20914560/932377.jpg?323%22%3E%3CLINK_TEXT%20text=%22http://www.ineeddonuts.co.uk/uploads/2/%20...%2077.jpg?323%22%3Ehttp://www.ineeddonuts.co.uk/uploads/2/0/9/1/20914560/932377.jpg?323%3C/LINK_TEXT%3E%3C/URL%3E%3Ce%3E)


There is more merit to a donuts hole than the void between your hairy ears, that's for sure.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: RW on August 17, 2015, 12:24:26 AM
Let's talk guns people.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Frood on August 17, 2015, 12:25:42 AM
Sounds nice, RW.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 17, 2015, 02:09:41 AM
Quote from: "Dinky Dianna"
Quote from: "SPECTRE"Well, another lesson learned.



Donut batter is a better thought processing medium than Dinky's brain.



Stay out of Krispy Kreme, Dinks...you'll end up arguing with a Chocolate Cream over the merits of the hole.



(//%3C/s%3E%3CURL%20url=%22http://www.ineeddonuts.co.uk/uploads/2/0/9/1/20914560/932377.jpg?323%22%3E%3CLINK_TEXT%20text=%22http://www.ineeddonuts.co.uk/uploads/2/%20...%2077.jpg?323%22%3Ehttp://www.ineeddonuts.co.uk/uploads/2/0/9/1/20914560/932377.jpg?323%3C/LINK_TEXT%3E%3C/URL%3E%3Ce%3E)


There is more merit to a donuts hole than the void between your hairy ears, that's for sure.


 :001_rolleyes:



What a (//%3C/s%3E%3CURL%20url=%22http://s.productreview.com.au/products/images/cadbury-flake_4fc840e69719e.jpg%22%3E%3CLINK_TEXT%20text=%22http://s.productreview.com.au/products/%20...%2069719e.jpg%22%3Ehttp://s.productreview.com.au/products/images/cadbury-flake_4fc840e69719e.jpg%3C/LINK_TEXT%3E%3C/URL%3E%3Ce%3E)
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Lance Leftardashian on August 24, 2015, 06:02:15 PM
We mustn't generalise.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Anonymous on August 24, 2015, 09:45:35 PM
Quote from: "Lance Leftardashian"We mustn't generalise.

Generally speaking, your posts are illogical.
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 26, 2015, 07:19:50 PM
Oh look.



Another slaughter of innocents.



By an African American.



With a gun.



http://www.skynews.com.au/news/top-stories/2015/08/27/suspect-in-us-live-tv-killing-shoots-self.html
Title: Re: 8 more slaughtered in the US.
Post by: Bricktop on August 26, 2015, 07:21:40 PM
And another...



http://www.skynews.com.au/news/top-stories/2015/08/27/three-people-reportedly-shot-in-louisiana.html
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