So DSM, tell me more about this "once saved permanently saved" stuff

[Garraty_47]

Christians have been saying the end times were coming since their religion's beginning times were beginning.  No generation has been right so far...

What amuses me the most is it's always the same people who impose Israel on the Palestinians, run around starting wars (and rumors of same), etc. who also jump up and down shouting 'See! See!' as if they haven't spent the past half-century and more *creating* conditions that at least superficially resemble their "prophecies".

I'm not sure if they just think we're all really, really stupid or if they honestly don't even know how obvious that nonsense is.

[Frood]

Christians have been saying the end times were coming since their religion's beginning times were beginning.  No generation has been right so far...

And in their fine print, it says that nobody will know when and should never pretend to know otherwise.

Wonderful escape clause.... like Nostradamus's vague quatrains.. 

[Garraty_47]

I wonder if I wrote a book with a lot of outrageous bullshit sprinkled with references to current events and famous people if, in a couple hundred years, anyone might start waving the book around and saying things like:

"No look! Right here! He talks about 'Frank Zappa' and we know for certain Frank Zappa was a real person. And in this chapter he talks about New Orleans being flooded by a hurricane and that's a well-documented fact! Therefore the invisible winged ponies who rule the moon *must* be real too!"

That would be awesome.

[Bonesaw]

Oh you know some people's heads would explode if they saw some of the scientific accuracies Muslims claim are in the Quran, like all living things are made of water... not dirt.

No good reason I shouldn't believe that old book instead. 

And then there's the fact that the Abrahamic religions all swiped concepts from Zoroastrianism that came hundreds of years earlier, it's just that the latter didn't happen to popularized by one of the greatest empires in history.

But sitting on my high horse of agnosticism, I get to watch people on every side grasp at straws and make science/scripture connections that don't exist or are more likely coincidence written by people who probably got fucking lucky throwing shit at the wall hoping it stuck... and if it didn't someone could just add or edit a few centuries later when people knew better.  And then modern day theists just pretend the abhorrent parts are irrelevant, because they just can't hope to sell non-believers on some of the twisted shit to which God gives the "okay", if they truly even believe it themselves...

   What a headache.

[Lokmar]

LOL! I can see none of the science zealots wanna look under the hood. Fear is a powerful thing! 

[Brent]

With that context in mind how do you explain Matthew 24:13 "he who endures to the end is the one who will saved" while maintaining consistency with your belief?

Jesus' warning only applies to people who personally watched Him perform miracles under the power of the Holy Spirit. Today, the unforgiveable sin is rejecting Jesus' sacrifice (Hebrews 11:6).

To blaspheme against the Holy Spirit today is to reject God's work, particularly God's work to convince us about Jesus (John 15:26)

[Frood]

LOL! I can see none of the science zealots wanna look under the hood. Fear is a powerful thing! 

I don't care to look under any hoods much. Science and Religion lie constantly. I'd rather not live in fear of things I can not know and maybe even after death, still can never know.

But I believe in the spirit of goodness.... basic goodness... so I thank the Judeo-Christian faiths... and even the Buddhists for their brevities.

My religion is ignorance yet my spirituality is hope and kindness.

[Lokmar]

I don't care to look under any hoods much. Science and Religion lie constantly. I'd rather not live in fear of things I can not know and maybe even after death, still can never know.

But I believe in the spirit of goodness.... basic goodness... so I thank the Judeo-Christian faiths... and even the Buddhists for their brevities.

My religion is ignorance yet my spirituality is hope and kindness.

Dear lord, its 5 minutes......

[Frood]

Dear lord, its 5 minutes......

Yet an orgasm lasts for much less...

[deadskinmask]

i dunno why ppl insist on arguing over "religion" of all things.... organized religion seems to be the one of the biggest creators of this unusual phenomenon.... ppl often like to snap at me over my beliefs also.... mine are fuckin simple as hell.... i've been watching government lie, misrepresent and distort the truth for my entire life.... i just straight-up DON'T FUCKIN TRUST EM.... about anything.... ever.... the Bible even says "don't trust ppl" numerous times.... apart from "be not afraid", its one of the most referenced messages.... if i HAVE to trust something, i suppose i'll choose God, Jesus and the Bible.... because whatever you believe, whether its dinosaurs, aliens, evolution, round earth moon landings and/or big bang.... at some point all of their "evidence" requires a certain amount of trust from you....

[Lokmar]

i dunno why ppl insist on arguing over "religion" of all things.... organized religion seems to be the one of the biggest creators of this unusual phenomenon.... ppl often like to snap at me over my beliefs also.... mine are fuckin simple as hell.... i've been watching government lie, misrepresent and distort the truth for my entire life.... i just straight-up DON'T FUCKIN TRUST EM.... about anything.... ever.... the Bible even says "don't trust ppl" numerous times.... apart from "be not afraid", its one of the most referenced messages.... if i HAVE to trust something, i suppose i'll choose God, Jesus and the Bible.... because whatever you believe, whether its dinosaurs, aliens, evolution, round earth moon landings and/or big bang.... at some point all of their "evidence" requires a certain amount of trust from you....

True. As has been demonstrated over and over, knowledge increases on both sides which changes our understanding. Science is constantly finding itself wrong and then having to completely change its theories or declarations. The scientific community doesnt seem to be able to admit its faults.

As far as the Genesis account, I've yet to see where it has been disproven. Science and the Bible align on the order of creation. Now if a bunch of cavemen assembled the Genesis narrative, what are the chances that the would have gotten the order of creation right?

[Reggie Essent]

<Sigh>

Maybe it so happens that it is what you believe during life that is what will happen to you after death.

It is written in the Big Book of Science that energy cannot be destroyed, only displaced.  It is also said that consciousness, you, the soul of the self, is simply an "engram,"  an electrical pattern in a living brain.

What happens to that energy pattern when the brain stops living?  Energy cannot be destroyed, only displaced, right? Doesn't that energy pattern exist, at the quantum level, across all of time and space? Certain theorems of Theoretical Physics seem to suggest so.

So maybe what we believe during life is what gets engraved within our engrams, in the energy patterns of our souls, and that's what happens to us after death across all of time and space.

If you're a Christian or a Muslim or a Jew, your faith in the tenets of Abraham's God will shape the engram of your soul, and after you die that engram will exist across all time and space, and you shall enjoy the joys of Heaven or not according to the tenets of Abraham's God.

If you believe in the Cosmic Wheel, that your soul is returned again and again to the living world until you get it just right, maybe that is what happens to you, again and again, until you get it just right across all time and space.

If you're an Atheist and believe you're just a biological animal and the center of your self is just a series of electrical discharges across the synapses of your living brain, and that once that brain dies "you" go poof into eternal oblivion, maybe that's what happens to you across all time and space.



 ... and yes, this dispensary weed is really good.

[deadskinmask]

True. As has been demonstrated over and over, knowledge increases on both sides which changes our understanding. Science is constantly finding itself wrong and then having to completely change its theories or declarations. The scientific community doesnt seem to be able to admit its faults.

As far as the Genesis account, I've yet to see where it has been disproven. Science and the Bible align on the order of creation. Now if a bunch of cavemen assembled the Genesis narrative, what are the chances that the would have gotten the order of creation right?

science was pretty cool at one time.... now its become a political tool.... i knew when they took homosexuality out of the DSM, it was the beginning of the end....

[deadskinmask]

<Sigh>

Maybe it so happens that it is what you believe during life that is what will happen to you after death.

It is written in the Big Book of Science that energy cannot be destroyed, only displaced.  It is also said that consciousness, you, the soul of the self, is simply an "engram,"  an electrical pattern in a living brain.

What happens to that energy pattern when the brain stops living?  Energy cannot be destroyed, only displaced, right? Doesn't that energy pattern exist, at the quantum level, across all of time and space? Certain theorems of Theoretical Physics seem to suggest so.

So maybe what we believe during life is what gets engraved within our engrams, in the energy patterns of our souls, and that's what happens to us after death across all of time and space.

If you're a Christian or a Muslim or a Jew, your faith in the tenets of Abraham's God will shape the engram of your soul, and after you die that engram will exist across all time and space, and you shall enjoy the joys of Heaven0.

If you believe in the Cosmic Wheel, that your soul is returned again and again to the living world until you get it just right, maybe that is what happens to you, again and again, until you get it just right across all time and space.

If you're an Atheist and believe you're just a biological animal and the center of your self is just a series of electrical discharges across the synapses of your living brain, and that once that brain dies "you" go poof into eternal oblivion, maybe that's what happens to you across all time and space.



 ... and yes, this dispensary weed is really good.

thats a really good and really well-written take....

[Adolf Oliver Bush]

Sounds more like disrespect for your maker...

You're basically calling your creator incompetent.   

Remember, according to these cultists, God created Man in his image. Which in turn means that at some point their god but his own dick on the chopping block and went at it with a meat cleaver or something, because reasons.

Like psychopathy and full blown BDSM malarkey etcetera.

Hold up...

You don't believe in evolution?

  

You have to admit, he's not very evolved. He would tell you god created him in one day. And I would be forced to admit he looked like a rushed job.

Yeah, when the discussion/debate reaches the point of:

"Everything in the bible is 100% true and accurate."
"How do you know that?"
"IT SAYS SO IN THE BIBLE!"

...I'm out. lulz

It's almost that self same fallacious "logic" you get when troons and their supporters have to define what a woman is, aye?