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 Post subject: Re: Wexit
Unread postPosted: November 5th, 2019, 7:40 pm 
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seoulbro wrote:
From Statscan - the exports / imports for ABSKMB is surplus +$94 billion. The export / imports deficit for Eastern Canada is -$145 billion. BC is deficit of -$12 billion.
Canada net deficit in exports / imports is -$60 billion. Majority of AB export / imports is with the USA. Net is Canada needs Alberta.

Canada would go broke without Alberta.

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 Post subject: Re: Wexit
Unread postPosted: November 6th, 2019, 6:02 pm 
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Alberta county calls for independence referendum

https://westernstandardonline.com/2019/ ... 9N5-g7om8Y
Wheatland County in southern Alberta passed a resolution on Tuesday demanding changes in confederation – that if rejected by Ottawa – would trigger a referendum on Alberta’s independence.

STRATHMORE, AB: Wheatland County in southern Alberta passed a resolution on Tuesday demanding changes in confederation – that if rejected by Ottawa – would trigger a referendum on Alberta’s independence.

The resolution, by Jason Wilson, a councillor in Wheatland County, was passed unanimously and will now be sent to municipalities and cities across Alberta for their input.

The motion calls for the province’s withdrawal from the Canada Pension Plan, a start to collecting it’s own income tax, the end of equalization payments, Senate reform, replacing the RCMP and better control over immigration into Alberta.

Wilson’s resolution says if those issues aren’t dealt with then a referendum on independence would be held Oct. 18, 2021.

“We can’t silence debate. I’m not a separatist. I’m an Albertan and I want to fix confederation,” Wilson said at the council meeting near Strathmore Tuesday.

“If things aren’t fixed we are going to continue to bend over.”

Wilson was a Jason Kenney delegate for his 2017 run for the PC leadership, and currently holds memberships in the United Conservative Party of Alberta, Freedom Conservative Party of Alberta, and the People’s Party of Canada.

People’s Party of Canada candidate for the area’s Bow River constituency Tom Ikert is also a Wheatland councillor, and voted for the motion.

The reeve of Wheatland County, Amber Link, said she expected the motion to be met with strong support across the province.

In an interview, Wilson told the Western Standard it was a deep sense of frustration that led to him bringing forward the motion.

He said while door-knocking for a friend running for office, all he heard from voters was their frustration where Alberta is at the moment in Confederation.

“I’m a sixth generation Albertan. Our family has lost members in both World Wars. They were fighting for a better future that might now be getting thrown under the bus. Our family didn’t lose (a member) in World War One to have Justin Trudeau throw away all our values,” he said.

Wilson said he will now work with other municipal officials across the province to “tweak” the motion to have it ready for a central zone meeting in February, followed by a province-wide meeting in March.

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 Post subject: Re: Wexit
Unread postPosted: November 6th, 2019, 6:15 pm 
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Former NB premier Frank McKenna.
https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/canada/vide ... na~1821012

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 Post subject: Re: Wexit
Unread postPosted: November 7th, 2019, 5:41 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Wexit
Unread postPosted: November 7th, 2019, 5:53 pm 
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I thought this was interesting.

There is at least one major politician in this country who has publicly expressed a desire to separate from Canada if he didn’t get his way politically.

That politician is Justin Trudeau.

In 2012, he said on Radio-Canada: “I always say, if there came a point where I thought Canada really was Stephen Harper’s Canada—that we were against abortion, against gay marriage, that we went backwards in 10,000 different ways—maybe I’d consider making Quebec a country. Oh yes. Absolutely. I know my values very well, even if I no longer recognized Canada.”

Within days, he turned on that position entirely. All was forgiven and forgotten.

Jason Kenney, the premier of Alberta, does not get such an easy ride. For merely bringing up the fact that separatist sentiment in Alberta is on the rise—a trend apparent years before he returned to Midnapore from Ottawa—he has been lambasted as a politician attempting to stoke that sentiment for his own political gain. As if he needed the boost.

https://www.macleans.ca/news/canada/why ... n_on_Wexit

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 Post subject: Re: Wexit
Unread postPosted: November 7th, 2019, 6:35 pm 
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Fashionista wrote:
I thought this was interesting.

There is at least one major politician in this country who has publicly expressed a desire to separate from Canada if he didn’t get his way politically.

That politician is Justin Trudeau.

In 2012, he said on Radio-Canada: “I always say, if there came a point where I thought Canada really was Stephen Harper’s Canada—that we were against abortion, against gay marriage, that we went backwards in 10,000 different ways—maybe I’d consider making Quebec a country. Oh yes. Absolutely. I know my values very well, even if I no longer recognized Canada.”

Within days, he turned on that position entirely. All was forgiven and forgotten.

Jason Kenney, the premier of Alberta, does not get such an easy ride. For merely bringing up the fact that separatist sentiment in Alberta is on the rise—a trend apparent years before he returned to Midnapore from Ottawa—he has been lambasted as a politician attempting to stoke that sentiment for his own political gain. As if he needed the boost.

https://www.macleans.ca/news/canada/why ... n_on_Wexit

Only Quebeckers are allowed to talk like this.

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 Post subject: Re: Wexit
Unread postPosted: November 7th, 2019, 6:56 pm 
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iron horse jockey wrote:
Fashionista wrote:
I thought this was interesting.

There is at least one major politician in this country who has publicly expressed a desire to separate from Canada if he didn’t get his way politically.

That politician is Justin Trudeau.

In 2012, he said on Radio-Canada: “I always say, if there came a point where I thought Canada really was Stephen Harper’s Canada—that we were against abortion, against gay marriage, that we went backwards in 10,000 different ways—maybe I’d consider making Quebec a country. Oh yes. Absolutely. I know my values very well, even if I no longer recognized Canada.”

Within days, he turned on that position entirely. All was forgiven and forgotten.

Jason Kenney, the premier of Alberta, does not get such an easy ride. For merely bringing up the fact that separatist sentiment in Alberta is on the rise—a trend apparent years before he returned to Midnapore from Ottawa—he has been lambasted as a politician attempting to stoke that sentiment for his own political gain. As if he needed the boost.

https://www.macleans.ca/news/canada/why ... n_on_Wexit

Only Quebeckers are allowed to talk like this.

I remember Justine saying this.

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 Post subject: Re: Wexit
Unread postPosted: November 7th, 2019, 7:01 pm 
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Are you listening Eastern Canada

https://www.todayville.com/election-fol ... 6bTjL5broQ
Election follow up: A proud Canadian’s heartbreaking breakup letter with Canada

ubmitted by Mark Meincke of Okotoks
Dear Canada,
When I was a child, Pierre Elliott Trudeau was our Prime Minister, and when he instituted the National Energy Program, Alberta was devastated. My Dad was a successful business owner, who employed dozens and dozens of people. All his employees lost their jobs. We declared bankruptcy, and were foreclosed on. My Dad lost everything, so my parents, my sister and I lost our home.

Our family went from being successful, to living in our Uncles basement for a year. Our family spent a full year, with 10 people in a house that only had one bathroom. It was rough for all of us…but we made it through. Alberta eventually recovered, but our family never fully bounced back, and we still feel the pain to this day.

On October 21rst, you re-elected Justin Trudeau to be your Prime Minister.

Like you, I’m a proud Canadian, and have proven my loyalty by risking my life in a war zone to protect our country. I was wounded there, and have been suffering from those wounds for over 20 years. My family has also suffered from those wounds, and is still suffering today.

Canada, you elected a Prime Minister who said that Veterans were asking for more than the government is willing to give….so every day another Veteran who is desperate for help, takes their own life. Their cries for help continue to go unanswered.

Canada, you elected a Government who has openly declared they will destroy the Alberta energy sector, which will destroy Alberta. Your response…”Well, I guess Alberta should have diversified their economy…so tough luck”. You don’t seem to understand, that it’s more than the oil sector you’ve shut down. Hundreds of restaurants have already shut down, with hundreds more about too.. Downtown Calgary high rises are vacant, property values are dropping, and businesses of all sorts are evaporating with no end in sight.

Tens of thousands of people have lost their jobs, have gone bankrupt, and have lost their homes. Suicide is on the rise, and mental health is on the decline. All of this pain…and you don’t seem to notice. Still…somehow it is US who is paying YOU equalization payments. How is this possible? If you won’t help us by sending the cash back in our direction, at least stop taking our money until we can get back on our feet….please!

Canada, you chose to replace the cleanest, most ethical oil in the world with Saudi oil. By doing so, you are supporting a dictatorship that kills homosexuals, and subjugates women. How can you be in favor of human rights, gay rights, and women’s rights….and yet support Saudi oil?

The result of your decision, is LESS clean, ethical oil, and MORE dirty, unethical oil. ZERO improvement will occur with carbon emissions, instead there will be MORE emissions, and LESS progress on human rights. Destroying the Alberta energy sector goes against all of your beliefs and morals…yet somehow you still justify your decision.

When we pleaded for help, you rolled your eyes. When Alberta warned you that our separtist sentiment was on the rise, you scoffed. When Justin Trudeau…the man who openly hates the west won the election…you cheered. You cheered for the devastation of the west.

I love you Canada..I love you so very much. I love you so much that I’ve given all that I have to give to you. I love you, but we are in an abusive relationship.

There is no pain so great as unrequited love.

A good marriage is one where each has an equal say. A good marriage is one where each respects the opinions of the other, even if they disagree. In a good marriage, each spouse not just allows for the individuality of the other, they support and encourage individuality.

Alberta has done all that we can to be a good partner to you. We have put bread on the table, paid your bills, put your kids through school, and supported your freedom to be whoever you want to be. But still, …you don’t love us back. You don’t even want to treat us as casual friends. Alberta feels more than just left out, we feel despised.

Dear Canada, the time has come for us to go our separate ways. We love you…SOOOO MUCH, but we now realize that you will never love us back. For most of my life, Separation was not a possibility, but now I realize it’s the only way we can survive.

Heart broken,

Alberta

(Written by Mark E. Meincke, blending his real life story with the persona of Alberta)

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 Post subject: Re: Wexit
Unread postPosted: November 8th, 2019, 3:28 am 
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Great post Herman..

That's a good analogy between Alberta and the Eastern establishment.

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 Post subject: Re: Wexit
Unread postPosted: November 8th, 2019, 4:11 am 
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READY FOR LONG GAME
Premier Kenney says he needs political ammo to make sure Trans Mountain upgrade is built


CALGARY — You can expect everything and the kitchen sink will be put on the table.

Everything, that is, except splitting from Canada since Premier Jason Kenney says he will always be a proud Canadian.

Kenney speaks in

Red Deer Saturday.

His words are expected to be full of red-meat politics. The crowd will be hungry.

He has a game plan, organizing town halls across the province, some before Christmas. A panel will listen to what Albertans have to say in what will be the winter of our discontent.

By spring, Kenney wants a report on where Alberta should go from here.

Albertans expect action. Talk was cheap, now it’s worth squat.

The premier knows full well where the wind is blowing and how hard it blows.

Kenney says there’s a “compelling case” to do what Quebec did, exit the Canada Pension Plan and start an Alberta one.

Such a trial balloon went nowhere almost 20 years ago with another Liberal government hostile to Alberta.

The number crunchers say without Alberta in the CPP, other Canadians would have to pay more and Albertans would pay less in their own plan.

An exit would make the mucky-mucks in arrogant Ottawa sick to their well-fed stomachs.

You see, Albertans contribute more to CPP than Alberta retirees receive in payments.

From 2008 to 2017, what Albertans paid into CPP over and above what Alberta retirees scored in pension cash was almost $28 billion. That’s nearly four times higher than Ontario, the next highest contributor.

Kind of reminds you of equalization.

Kenney admits a lot of Albertans want a referendum vote on equalization now. They want to force Trudeau to negotiate with Alberta. Kenney defends his position to hold the vote in two years.

He needs the vote to get the Trans Mountain pipeline built.

"If we blow all our ammunition right now what leverage do we have 12, 18, 24 months from now when there are New Democrats and Green party members chaining themselves to pipes and tractors in the war in the woods?

“What leverage do we have on the federal government to ensure the application of the rule of law for the completion of that pipeline?”

The premier doesn’t completely write off the NDP or Bloc Quebecois trying to scuttle the project.

Then there’s Trudeau, talking big in Quebec about standing up to the big oil companies. That still bugs us. What did Kenney tell him? “If you want to stand up to our energy industry then why are you prepared to take the revenues it generates and the jobs it creates?”

But he does. The premier may also push Ottawa for an equalization rebate in these tough times. We shall see.

On Thursday, Notley and Kenney scuffle on the premier’s fight-back stance but the NDP leader played palsy-walsy with Trudeau. She’s not in the game.

Shannon Stubbs is a Conservative MP from Alberta. Stubbs calls it as she sees it. What she sees isn’t pretty.

Albertans have been kicked when they’re down.

Many folks are at the end of their rope and if they don’t see some light at the end of the tunnel soon they’ll start looking for an exit door from what has become an abusive relationship with Ottawa.

And please, don’t say Albertans are alienated.

Nobody says: You know, I feel alienated today.

As Stubbs puts it, people are furious. They don’t want special treatment. They just want the prime minister and the government to stop attacking them.

They see the election as “the rest of the country vindicating the prime minister.”

What’s going on is not just blowing off steam.

“It’s not ranting over a couple of beers or getting all carried away with your friends at the 6 a.m. coffee before you go out for another frustrating day in this disastrous harvest.”

“It’s a grave crisis” and “it’s absolutely appalling the prime minister seems completely unaware of that and it’s a direct result of him.”

If Trans Mountain doesn’t get done, “people will be apoplectic.”

An Alberta Pension Plan might get Ottawa to pay attention. Equalization is the hot button. Others want to hold Alberta back but they want our dough at the same time. Stubbs almost spits out the words as she speaks of the “galling double-standard and hypocrisy.”

Kenney says this fight is a marathon, not a sprint.

Earlier this week one of his team, Airdrie’s Angela Pitt, asks a good question.

“What does this government say to those struggling to wave a Canadian flag in this beautiful province?”

The clock ticks and, unlike a marathon, the finish line is unknown.

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 Post subject: Re: Wexit
Unread postPosted: November 9th, 2019, 7:18 pm 
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I like this autonomous stand of Kenney's. I hope Scott Moe follows suit.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/ ... -1.5354642
Alberta addresses separatist sentiment by studying measures that would give province more autonomy

Alberta's premier is addressing western alienation by taking a page out of Quebec's handbook and looking at ways to give the province more autonomy.

Alberta will open offices in other provinces, introduce an act to give Albertans the power to petition for referendums and create a panel to look at giving the province further independence, like pulling out of the Federal-Provincial Tax Collection Agreement or establishing a provincial police force.

Premier Jason Kenney made the sweeping announcement Saturday during a keynote address to close the Manning Conference in Red Deer, Alta., an event held by the Manning Centre, a Calgary-based right-wing think-tank.

"Albertans have been working for Ottawa for too long. It's time for Ottawa to start working for us … they must stop taking us for granted," Kenney said.

"They need to understand they're killing the golden goose. They have both fists wrapped around the throat of that goose."

Reform Party founder Preston Manning will sit on the panel, along with Stephen Lougheed, son of late former premier Peter Lougheed, former MLA Donna Kennedy-Glans and three current MLAs, among others.

Kenney said he wants to acknowledge that some Western Canadians no longer feel at home in their own country, and suggested "Laurentian elites" have both benefited from Alberta's wealth and abandoned the province in its time of need.

"How perverse is it to blame the victim in a sense when we have been doing so much to share our wealth with the rest of the country?" he asked.

But he said separation is not the answer, even though he views Prime Minister Justin Trudeau's minority government as "a danger" to the federation.

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 Post subject: Re: Wexit
Unread postPosted: November 9th, 2019, 7:21 pm 
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Some measures the new Fair Deal Panel will study include:

Establishing a provincial revenue agency by ending Alberta's Federal-Provincial Tax Collection Agreement.
Withdrawing from the Canada Pension Plan and establishing a provincial plan.
Ending the province's relationship with the RCMP and creating a provincial police force.
Opting out of federal cost-sharing programs.
Seeking an exchange of tax points for federal cash transfer.
Establishing a formal provincial constitution.
Appointing a Chief Firearms Office for the province.
"We must maintain leverage over the federal government over the next two years to ensure completion of the Trans Mountain pipeline expansion," Kenney said. "We must use wisdom to carefully stage each element of this fight for fairness."

Reform Party founder Preston Manning said that yearning for autonomy is one thing Quebec and the west have in common.

"Both want a more decentralized federation for somewhat different reasons. Quebec more for linguistic, cultural and social reasons, the west for economic reasons," he said.

The panel will consult with experts and hold town halls between Nov. 16 and Jan. 30, before completing a report to government by March 31, the release said. The panel's budget is set at $650,000.

If the panel finds support for those measures, Kenney said, the next move would be to hold referendums before moving forward — but that provision was not mentioned in his mandate letter to the panellists.

Alberta will also be opening offices in Ottawa, Quebec and B.C. to "defend the province's interests."

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 Post subject: Re: Wexit
Unread postPosted: November 9th, 2019, 7:22 pm 
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Similarities to 'firewall letter'
Kenney's speech shared some similarities with the famous letter that kicked off the Alberta Agenda in 2001 and called for "firewalls" to be built around the province.

That open letter, signed by future prime minister Stephen Harper among others and addressed to then-premier Ralph Klein, also called for a provincial police force and withdrawal from the Canada Pension Plan.

"Klein rejected it. He refused to move forward on it. Kenney is throwing the full weight of the government behind it. That's the difference between 2001 and today," Mount Royal University political science professor Duane Bratt said.

"The similarity is it's both in the aftermath of the Conservatives losing an election. And so you wonder, would any of this come about if there was a Conservative government? If you're pursuing an autonomous strategy, which this is within Canada, it shouldn't be dependent on who is in Ottawa."

Bratt said the speech was the most significant one Kenney has made as premier.

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 Post subject: Re: Wexit
Unread postPosted: November 9th, 2019, 7:28 pm 
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I can't believe what is happening in this country.

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 Post subject: Re: Wexit
Unread postPosted: November 9th, 2019, 7:31 pm 
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Gaon wrote:
I can't believe what is happening in this country.

Believe it brother. This is long overdue.

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 Post subject: Re: Wexit
Unread postPosted: November 10th, 2019, 3:37 am 
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Herman wrote:
Similarities to 'firewall letter'
Kenney's speech shared some similarities with the famous letter that kicked off the Alberta Agenda in 2001 and called for "firewalls" to be built around the province.

That open letter, signed by future prime minister Stephen Harper among others and addressed to then-premier Ralph Klein, also called for a provincial police force and withdrawal from the Canada Pension Plan.

"Klein rejected it. He refused to move forward on it. Kenney is throwing the full weight of the government behind it. That's the difference between 2001 and today," Mount Royal University political science professor Duane Bratt said.

"The similarity is it's both in the aftermath of the Conservatives losing an election. And so you wonder, would any of this come about if there was a Conservative government? If you're pursuing an autonomous strategy, which this is within Canada, it shouldn't be dependent on who is in Ottawa."

Bratt said the speech was the most significant one Kenney has made as premier.

Albertans contribute more to CPP per capita than any other province. If Alberta withdraws from CPP to start their own pension plan(it would be superior to CPP), they federal program would become insolvent.

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 Post subject: Re: Wexit
Unread postPosted: November 10th, 2019, 4:07 am 
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seoulbro wrote:
Herman wrote:
Similarities to 'firewall letter'
Kenney's speech shared some similarities with the famous letter that kicked off the Alberta Agenda in 2001 and called for "firewalls" to be built around the province.

That open letter, signed by future prime minister Stephen Harper among others and addressed to then-premier Ralph Klein, also called for a provincial police force and withdrawal from the Canada Pension Plan.

"Klein rejected it. He refused to move forward on it. Kenney is throwing the full weight of the government behind it. That's the difference between 2001 and today," Mount Royal University political science professor Duane Bratt said.

"The similarity is it's both in the aftermath of the Conservatives losing an election. And so you wonder, would any of this come about if there was a Conservative government? If you're pursuing an autonomous strategy, which this is within Canada, it shouldn't be dependent on who is in Ottawa."

Bratt said the speech was the most significant one Kenney has made as premier.

Albertans contribute more to CPP per capita than any other province. If Alberta withdraws from CPP to start their own pension plan(it would be superior to CPP), they federal program would become insolvent.

That is Ottawa's problem, not the West's. They cannot expect the prairie provinces to put up with theft and abuse indefinitely.

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 Post subject: Re: Wexit
Unread postPosted: November 10th, 2019, 6:48 am 
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Herman wrote:
Similarities to 'firewall letter'
Kenney's speech shared some similarities with the famous letter that kicked off the Alberta Agenda in 2001 and called for "firewalls" to be built around the province.

That open letter, signed by future prime minister Stephen Harper among others and addressed to then-premier Ralph Klein, also called for a provincial police force and withdrawal from the Canada Pension Plan.

"Klein rejected it. He refused to move forward on it. Kenney is throwing the full weight of the government behind it. That's the difference between 2001 and today," Mount Royal University political science professor Duane Bratt said.

"The similarity is it's both in the aftermath of the Conservatives losing an election. And so you wonder, would any of this come about if there was a Conservative government? If you're pursuing an autonomous strategy, which this is within Canada, it shouldn't be dependent on who is in Ottawa."

Bratt said the speech was the most significant one Kenney has made as premier.

wow :shock:

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 Post subject: Re: Wexit
Unread postPosted: November 10th, 2019, 7:51 am 

Joined: July 20th, 2015, 2:33 pm
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Gaon wrote:
I can't believe what is happening in this country.

It is overdue my friend.

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 Post subject: Re: Wexit
Unread postPosted: November 10th, 2019, 10:26 pm 
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Use pension plan as warning

Equalization isn’t the only financial arrangement in this country that is stacked against Alberta, the Canada Pension Plan is, too.

If Alberta withdrew from the CPP, not only could Alberta pay their own retirees more for lower contributions, the rest of the country would finally get a practical lesson in why it needs Alberta around — and why it should find a fairer deal to keep that province in Confederation. This week, Premier Jason Kenney said there is a “compelling case” for Alberta to at least look at going it alone on pensions, the way Quebec has done for five decades.

He intends to put the question of a separate APP in front of the panel of distinguished Albertans he will soon appoint to offer recommendations on how Alberta should deal with the seemingly disinterested Trudeau government in Ottawa.

It is well known in that province that Albertans contribute upwards of $20 billion more a year to Confederation than they receive back in benefits.

Of course, a country isn’t just a ledger sheet or a zero-sum calculation. They don’t have to receive back as much as thet put in. But neither should the provinces who benefit most from their generous contributions smugly deny their ability to develop their biggest industries and maintain their way of life.

Of course we’re talking about Quebec. Quebec is the primary beneficiary of Alberta's largesse. Despite the fact that it now has per capita wealth very close to the national average, the federal Liberals have increased Quebec’s equalization every year because it benefits them politically to do so. And even though the bulk of Quebec’s $13 billion or $14 billion grant each year comes from Alberta, no other province has been as hostile to Alberta pipelines or as moralistic about the environmental consequences of developing the oilsands. (OK, B.C. has been nearly as bad, but at least it isn’t as heavily dependent on our money.) The CPP is nearly as bad a deal for Alberta as equalization, though. Last year, Albertans contributed 16.5 per cent of all premiums collected by the CPP. However, Alberta is just 11.6 per cent of the national population. Worse yet, their seniors received just 10.6 per cent of the payments made. That’s a gap of 56 per cent. According to Vancouver’s Fraser Institute, over the past decade Albertans have chipped in $27 billion more than they have taken out of CPP. Unlike equalization, this gap isn’t the result of some political manipulation designed to keep Liberal-voting regions of the country happy. It’s because was have the youngest population in the country and the highest incomes. We simply have more people making solid livings than we have older citizens receiving payments. Still, the gap is what gives us leverage. If we took our premiums and set up our own public pension, Ottawa would either have to raise CPP contributions substantially or lower benefits significantly in the rest of Canada. Maybe that’s the kind of warning shot we should fire across Ottawa’s bow to startle them out of their complacency — even hostility — towards Alberta.

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