QuoteCanadians have known for a long time that the public sector pension scheme is unfair to taxpayers and small business owners, but it is also becoming clear that many public plans are structurally unbalanced and in need of immediate reform. Based on evidence that is available from Statistics Canada, Public Accounts and other sources, the unfunded shortfall for public pension plans across the country likely exceeds $300 billion. That works out to $9,000 from every man, woman and child in Canada.  

http://www.cfib-fcei.ca/english/article/4034-canada-s-hidden-unfunded-public-sector-pension-liabilities.html">http://www.cfib-fcei.ca/english/article ... ities.html">http://www.cfib-fcei.ca/english/article/4034-canada-s-hidden-unfunded-public-sector-pension-liabilities.html

Quote from: "Shen Li"The feds, the provinces and municipalities across Canada are struggling with what to do about unfunded defined benefit pensions. New Brunswick was forced to make changes to it's pension plans to avoid $1 billion in unfunded liabilities. There are governments here that could end up like Stockton, California.



How long will Canadians in the private sector, most of whom do not have a defined benefit plan tolerate paying for unreasonable pensions to politicians and snivel serpents?

QuoteCanadians have known for a long time that the public sector pension scheme is unfair to taxpayers and small business owners, but it is also becoming clear that many public plans are structurally unbalanced and in need of immediate reform. Based on evidence that is available from Statistics Canada, Public Accounts and other sources, the unfunded shortfall for public pension plans across the country likely exceeds $300 billion. That works out to $9,000 from every man, woman and child in Canada.  

http://www.cfib-fcei.ca/english/article/4034-canada-s-hidden-unfunded-public-sector-pension-liabilities.html">http://www.cfib-fcei.ca/english/article ... ities.html">http://www.cfib-fcei.ca/english/article/4034-canada-s-hidden-unfunded-public-sector-pension-liabilities.html

Quote from: "Shen Li"The feds, the provinces and municipalities across Canada are struggling with what to do about unfunded defined benefit pensions. New Brunswick was forced to make changes to it's pension plans to avoid $1 billion in unfunded liabilities. There are governments here that could end up like Stockton, California.



How long will Canadians in the private sector, most of whom do not have a defined benefit plan tolerate paying for unreasonable pensions to politicians and snivel serpents?

QuoteCanadians have known for a long time that the public sector pension scheme is unfair to taxpayers and small business owners, but it is also becoming clear that many public plans are structurally unbalanced and in need of immediate reform. Based on evidence that is available from Statistics Canada, Public Accounts and other sources, the unfunded shortfall for public pension plans across the country likely exceeds $300 billion. That works out to $9,000 from every man, woman and child in Canada.  

http://www.cfib-fcei.ca/english/article/4034-canada-s-hidden-unfunded-public-sector-pension-liabilities.html">http://www.cfib-fcei.ca/english/article ... ities.html">http://www.cfib-fcei.ca/english/article/4034-canada-s-hidden-unfunded-public-sector-pension-liabilities.html

Quote from: "Fashionista"

Quote from: "Shen Li"The feds, the provinces and municipalities across Canada are struggling with what to do about unfunded defined benefit pensions. New Brunswick was forced to make changes to it's pension plans to avoid $1 billion in unfunded liabilities. There are governments here that could end up like Stockton, California.



How long will Canadians in the private sector, most of whom do not have a defined benefit plan tolerate paying for unreasonable pensions to politicians and snivel serpents?

QuoteCanadians have known for a long time that the public sector pension scheme is unfair to taxpayers and small business owners, but it is also becoming clear that many public plans are structurally unbalanced and in need of immediate reform. Based on evidence that is available from Statistics Canada, Public Accounts and other sources, the unfunded shortfall for public pension plans across the country likely exceeds $300 billion. That works out to $9,000 from every man, woman and child in Canada.  

http://www.cfib-fcei.ca/english/article/4034-canada-s-hidden-unfunded-public-sector-pension-liabilities.html">http://www.cfib-fcei.ca/english/article ... ities.html">http://www.cfib-fcei.ca/english/article/4034-canada-s-hidden-unfunded-public-sector-pension-liabilities.html

Shen Li, one of the reasons I have stayed with the provincial civil service is because of the pension that I have been paying into and count on collecting some day..



The other is the flexibility of my job....it allows me to be there for my family when they need me..



Wages in Alberta outside the civil service are usually higher than in it..



Change the pension and the province may find it hard to recruit good people.

Quote from: "Obvious Li"

Quote from: "Fashionista"

Quote from: "Shen Li"The feds, the provinces and municipalities across Canada are struggling with what to do about unfunded defined benefit pensions. New Brunswick was forced to make changes to it's pension plans to avoid $1 billion in unfunded liabilities. There are governments here that could end up like Stockton, California.



How long will Canadians in the private sector, most of whom do not have a defined benefit plan tolerate paying for unreasonable pensions to politicians and snivel serpents?

Shen Li, one of the reasons I have stayed with the provincial civil service is because of the pension that I have been paying into and count on collecting some day..



The other is the flexibility of my job....it allows me to be there for my family when they need me..



Wages in Alberta outside the civil service are usually higher than in it..



Change the pension and the province may find it hard to recruit good people.

governments and snivel servants multiply like rats...and need to be exterminated like rats.....cut cut cut...reduce reduce reduce.......fire fire fire.......cut cut cut......lay off lay off lay off.....gone gone gone..... :mrgreen:

Quote from: "Fashionista"

Quote from: "Obvious Li"

Quote from: "Fashionista"
Shen Li, one of the reasons I have stayed with the provincial civil service is because of the pension that I have been paying into and count on collecting some day..



The other is the flexibility of my job....it allows me to be there for my family when they need me..



Wages in Alberta outside the civil service are usually higher than in it..



Change the pension and the province may find it hard to recruit good people.

governments and snivel servants multiply like rats...and need to be exterminated like rats.....cut cut cut...reduce reduce reduce.......fire fire fire.......cut cut cut......lay off lay off lay off.....gone gone gone..... :mrgreen:

Mr. Obvious Li, someone still has to do my job even if my position was contracted out..



Would they be able to do it more efficiently than me?

Quote from: "Obvious Li"

Quote from: "Fashionista"

Quote from: "Obvious Li"


governments and snivel servants multiply like rats...and need to be exterminated like rats.....cut cut cut...reduce reduce reduce.......fire fire fire.......cut cut cut......lay off lay off lay off.....gone gone gone..... :mrgreen:

Mr. Obvious Li, someone still has to do my job even if my position was contracted out..



Would they be able to do it more efficiently than me?

of course they don't...you should be able to fit all govt. employees in a telephone booth...remember there was a time when snivel servants were few and far between and the country ran just fine...get rid of wasteful govt. programs and regulations and the crats who administer them at the same time...cut cut cut....gone gone gone save save save money

Quote from: "Romero"Government employees perform exceptional service for their deserved pay and benefits. They keep the country going, no less than the private sector.



Teachers. Nurses. Police, firefighters and ambulance drivers. Perhaps somebody sitting at a desk helping to approve business or development. Somebody fixing a pothole.



Now imagine if it were all cut and privatized. Yeah and oh great, many people would be out of a job or working minimum wage. That's real good for the economy.



And we'd all be paying a lot more for every little thing. Every single time we need a job, health care, our kids getting education. A private toll along every road. Higher costs and less manpower for simply keeping government open to business.



Government workers cut our costs and deserve decent employment and wage for their hard work. We would expect nothing less from the private sector.

Quote from: "Romero"Taxes have fallen. It hasn't helped things any. Either way, it's still more cost effective and profitable to have government workers doing their job to keep things going.



They perform a service and add to the economy. You said more money is paradise, yet you're arguing for some to make less than they deserve for doing an important job.

Quote from: "Romero"You and your baby ever been in a hospital? Government workers making a decent wage for a hard job. Many of them work behind a desk.



You're working in the private sector enjoying government benefits like health care and education. People like Fash are to thank.

Quote from: "Shen Li"

Quote from: "Romero"You and your baby ever been in a hospital? Government workers making a decent wage for a hard job. Many of them work behind a desk.



You're working in the private sector enjoying government benefits like health care and education. People like Fash are to thank.

Government doesn't pay that well, they just have those unsustainable defined benefit pensions. Governments overpay unskilled workers and underpay highly skilled workers. They also slice responsibilities far too thin. Get rid of them and return the money to the people. it's our cash, we earned it, not the CUPE, AUPE and municipal public sector unions.

QuoteWe are losing front door mail delivery in Canada, but the big story is why we are losing it.



Pension costs.



That's right, those of us who still get mail to our door will lose this service due to the huge cost of the pensions Canada Post needs to pay out.



This is the big story here — not that we are losing a particular style of mail delivery, but why.



Canada Post has a $6.5 billion hole in its pension plan. That means they owe money to pensioners or current employees that they just don't have and that is a big driver of these cuts.



Anyone upset about losing postal service to their door should be upset at the cost of the pension plans on offer to postal workers, the inability of past negotiators to say no and the bad planning that saw this huge, unfunded liability grow.



This unfunded liability means taxpayers will have to bail out Canada Post, either through service cuts or, if that doesn't work, a bailout down the road.



Unfortunately, Canada Post is not alone.



Across the public sector, lavish pensions, the kind no one in the private sector gets, are putting the future of government services at risk.



Canadians have fewer children than 40 years ago when I was a tot and many of these pension The Canadian Federation of Independent Business estimates public-sector pension plans across Canada could be on the hook for as much as $300 billion they do not have.



In the future, we will have more retirees and fewer workers.



arrangements were becoming solidified.



We also used to have five workers for every one retiree; soon it will be two to one.



We won't have enough money to pay for the pensions promised.



What happens then?



Well, look to Detroit for an idea.



Retirees in Detroit were promised pensions the city could not afford and eventually the city went broke.



The city has slashed services and the retirees who were relying on those pensions now face seeing their monthly payments cut as the city restructures.



We need pension reform in this country before the same thing happens.



It might sound cold to argue that we need to cut pension benefits, but what is more compassionate?



Is it promising what can be paid out so people can plan for their future with some certainty, or promising more than we can afford and then granny's pension is cut in half when she is 75 and no longer able to work to supplement her income?



It also isn't fair to ask private-sector workers, who on average earn less than the civil servants they support through taxes, to also pony up for the very generous pensions they won't get themselves.



Most private-sector workers don't have pension plans, they save on their own — or at least they should.



Those who do have pensions likely have defined contribution plans rather than the defined benefit plans so many government workers have.



In defined contribution you, the worker, put in so many dollars, the employers matches it and the money is invested — by you as your retirement fund.



This is what the feds, the provinces and municipalities should be moving toward and they should do it now before it is too late and granny gets cut off in her golden years.

http://www.edmontonsun.com/2013/12/12/postal-pension-prop-unfunded-liability-means-canadians-will-have-to-bail-out-canada-post">http://www.edmontonsun.com/2013/12/12/p ... anada-post">http://www.edmontonsun.com/2013/12/12/postal-pension-prop-unfunded-liability-means-canadians-will-have-to-bail-out-canada-post