Quote from: Prof Emeritus at Fawk U on September 15, 2024, 08:12:40 PMI understand your concern about their capabilities, but I'm saying Putin doesn't have the will to push the button.  He's a bluffing retard at this point.  Yes, I would prefer that the fighting stops, but it shouldn't stop on Russian terms.

The terms have to be mutually agreeable or it isn't going to stop. And authorizing the use of long range US made missiles is in no way going to facilitate achieving a favorable outcome

Quote from: Thiel on September 15, 2024, 08:08:55 PMLikewise, Zelensky would have surrendered long ago if America had not been arming him.

I dunno.  Ukies are stubborn assholes.  Just ask Herman.  They've been fighting their cousins from up by Moscow for a thousand years or so.  The way Putin's initial "invasion" failed miserably shows that the "war" wouldn't have gone much differently than it has regardless of how many American tax dollars have been pumnped into it.

At this point, I am inclined to think that both the Russkies and the Ukies are milking this litle war for every American tax dollar they can squeeze out of it.

Quote from: Biggie Smiles on September 15, 2024, 08:16:33 PMThe terms have to be mutually agreeable or it isn't going to stop. And authorizing the use of long range US made missiles is in no way going to facilitate achieving a favorable outcome

Giving Ukraine the means of striking Moscow would cause enough of a headache for Putin to consider negotiations.  I don't see where it would escalate beyond that.

Quote from: Reggie Essent on September 15, 2024, 08:18:32 PMAt this point, I am inclined to think that both the Russkies and the Ukies are milking this litle war for every American tax dollar they can squeeze out of it.

This wouldn't surprise me at all. Zelly, Putin and the democrat/Rino scum are all in out. We lose dollars they lose lives and at the end of it all a select few get filthy fucking rich

and you have one man coming along looking to throw a monkey wrench into that gravy train and they are ALL trying to stop him by any means possible

Quote from: Prof Emeritus at Fawk U on September 15, 2024, 08:22:40 PMGiving Ukraine the means of striking Moscow would cause enough of a headache for Putin to consider negotiations.  I don't see where it would escalate beyond that.

That's quite a gamble you are proposing there. When an animal is cornered it tends to bite.

Quote from: Biggie Smiles on September 15, 2024, 08:24:26 PMThat's quite a gamble you are proposing there. When an animal is cornered it tends to bite.

Putin is bluffing and that is the bottom line.  He's not going to risk nuclear war just to save face.

Quote from: Biggie Smiles on September 15, 2024, 08:16:33 PMThe terms have to be mutually agreeable or it isn't going to stop. And authorizing the use of long range US made missiles is in no way going to facilitate achieving a favorable outcome

Yes I agree Biggie Smiles Bigly.

The War needs to come to an End...and soon.

It's gotten out of hand to the point where it threatens the entire World.

World can only sacrifice so much for the Ukraine.

I agree that they ought to be allowed Independence & assurances of sovereignty but they'll have to give up some of their territory for peace.

I agree with Trump's idea of a DMZ.

Quote from: Prof Emeritus at Fawk U on September 15, 2024, 08:01:39 PMDude, Vietnam doesn't share a border with us so the logistics involved in conquering them would easily require around 20 million troops, which is completely insane given the distance.

As for Putin, he's not going to risk having a mushroom cloud pop up over Moscow just because he wants to be a badass.  He's resorting to bluster just to provide prolefeed to the idiots that support him.

I dont agree. I honestly believe that Putin  would risk a nuclear exchange if Moscow starts getting smoked. At the very least, expect Russian operatives to fuck up their immediate neighbors.

Quote from: Prof Emeritus at Fawk U on September 15, 2024, 08:25:36 PMPutin is bluffing and that is the bottom line.  He's not going to risk nuclear war just to save face.

Putin is not going to surrender just because Ukraine can reach Moscow with missiles.

that would be a dumb maneuver because we all know that if Putin does come to the table he'll be pressed with terms NO ONE in his position could ever agree to. Why? Because the vermin in the industrial war complex that control the puppets in gov does not want the war to end

This is saddam hussien all over again. Saddam was accused of having weapons of mass destruction and no matter how much and how often or to what extent he allowed the weapons inspectors access to his alleged WMDs they were going to pin him to that accusation.

it's a total rewind of the playbook, only this time, with a nuclear armed power capable of contributing to the destruction of life as we know it.

Quote from: JOE on September 15, 2024, 08:26:20 PMYes I agree Biggie Smiles Bigly.

The War needs to come to an End...and soon.

It's gotten out of hand to the point where it threatens the entire World.

World can only sacrifice so much for the Ukraine.

I agree that they ought to be allowed Independence & assurances of sovereignty but they'll have to give up some of their territory for peace.

I agree with Trump's idea of a DMZ.

Have you sent your apartheid era cons back to the South African president yet Joe?

PS: the postal service is in a shambles, you may have to send it via an independent mailing service.

Quote from: Lokmar on September 15, 2024, 08:29:54 PMI dont agree. I honestly believe that Putin  would risk a nuclear exchange if Moscow starts getting smoked. At the very least, expect Russian operatives to fuck up their immediate neighbors.

He'd be considered a true war criminal if he pushed the button.  The only smart way out for him is to try to push out the Ukrainians that are holding Russian territory and then call for a cease fire.

Quote from: Prof Emeritus at Fawk U on September 15, 2024, 08:33:25 PMHe'd be considered a true war criminal if he pushed the button.  The only smart way out for him is to try to push out the Ukrainians that are holding Russian territory and then call for a cease fire.

He's already a war criminal...and he's indeed crazy enough to push the button. The guy is a fucking Russian ffs!

Quote from: Prof Emeritus at Fawk U on September 15, 2024, 08:33:25 PMHe'd be considered a true war criminal if he pushed the button.  The only smart way out for him is to try to push out the Ukrainians that are holding Russian territory and then call for a cease fire.

And thats what I think happens when Trump gets back in.

If the bombs start falling on Moscow tho, look for a MAJOR escalation. Maybe not nukes but I guarantee you you'll see a barrage of heavy bombers dropping big shit on Ukraine at the very LEAST.

Quote from: Lab Flaker on September 15, 2024, 08:35:11 PMHe's already a war criminal...and he's indeed crazy enough to push the button. The guy is a fucking Russian ffs!

He might be ex-KGB, but he isn't psychotic enough to consider use of nukes. 

Quote from: Lab Flaker on September 15, 2024, 08:35:11 PMHe's already a war criminal...and he's indeed crazy enough to push the button. The guy is a fucking Russian ffs!

I also believe he would do it if things continued to escalate. I dont think it would happen immediately though. I could see if he started heavy bombing in Ukraine, NATO counters with direct intervention of forces, tit for tat, and then eventually, the missiles start flying.