Let me start by saying that I don't immediately jump on the bash the enemy train as soon as someone has a falling out with Trump. I like to examine WHY such a falling out occurred

and I certainly don't agree with the sudden and childish names Trump insists on pinning to former allies. It makes him look worse than it does them.

So lets take a look at a few of her stances and see where this malfunction started and how we can bridge the gaps to keep us united.

1. her stance on illegal alien roundups. I've said this over and over again -- this draconian roundem all up no matter what the context or circumstance is the wrong path forward. I understand that entering the country without proper authorization is a crime. I also understand that there are MILLIONS of shitbag liberals I would happily trade for many of the good hearted, hard working, community building, USA loving HUMAN BEINGS who happen to be here illegally. If they meet the criteria I listed above LET THEM STAY! I see no value in rolling up on a job site to round up people who are working their asses off to live peacefully. that's just bullshit and that is where her and I agree. Although we have different motivators. She owns a construction company that leverages cheap labor. I do not.

2. Her stance on Israel. I just don't understand why so many conservatives have fallen right of the wagon of sanity on this issue. Is it not possible to be America First WITHOUT the need to be "fuck your friend"? I believe BOTH can coexist. ESPECIALLY when we have a common enemy in the form of religious zealots hell bent on killing all of us. Geez.. so stand by as these lunatics swallow up a well armed nation which only makes THEM that much stronger? Are you serious?

3. This idea that we put America last by bombing Iran. Let me start by saying I don't give a shit if Iran had nukes or just simple fart bombs in those underground laboratories. BOMB THEM. Bomb them because the country name begins with I And ends with N as does not contain enough vowels. Bomb them because you need realistic targets to test new weaponry. Hell, bomb those fucks because it's Wednesday night and you have nothing better to do. FUCK THEM.   And yeah, I do believe that preventing those animals from achieving nuclear status is putting America first.. even if we are not seeing the ROI immediately.


anyone else know of any other gripes this woman has with Trump?

I didn't know she has fallen out of the good graces of the president. However, gossip about who likes who is not something I would do anything more than than read the headline.

You did make some rock solid points.

I have always thought that MTG was dumber than a post. I know she is one of us, but I'm sorry, that doesn't raise her IQ.

I disagree with MTG's stances on most things but I respect the fact that she's willing to take principled stands on issues that set her apart from the leadership in a movement she helped define and establish. Attacking her so viciously only makes Trump look weak and desperate; it's the sort of behavior I'd expect from democrats whenever someone making progressive/populist noises gets too close to having actual influence in their party.

If you can only be "in the club" if you agree with and support Dear Leader 100% of the time, even if it means doing an about-face on your previous positions, that club starts looking an awful lot like a cult.

Quote from: Biggie Smiles on November 15, 2025, 09:42:18 PM1. her stance on illegal alien roundups. I've said this over and over again -- this draconian roundem all up no matter what the context or circumstance is the wrong path forward. I understand that entering the country without proper authorization is a crime. I also understand that there are MILLIONS of shitbag liberals I would happily trade for many of the good hearted, hard working, community building, USA loving HUMAN BEINGS who happen to be here illegally. If they meet the criteria I listed above LET THEM STAY! I see no value in rolling up on a job site to round up people who are working their asses off to live peacefully. that's just bullshit and that is where her and I agree. Although we have different motivators. She owns a construction company that leverages cheap labor. I do not.

I disagree.  ALL illegal aliens must be accounted for and either removed or naturalized.  The Administration is bending over backwards to make this an ordered and peaceful process.  If they self-deport, we will give them a free flight and a stipend to hold them over and, most importantly, allow them to be put on a list for proper vetting and a legal return. If they get caught and deported by ICE, they can never return legally.

What I find disturbing and what you may not be taking into account are all the very long term illegals - people that have been here for decades yet have never taken steps to naturalize.  This clearly indicates that there is an incentive structure for these people to remain illegals.

It works something like this:  Juan and Juanita cross into the US illegally in the late 1990s.  Juanita is heavily pregnant and waddles into the nearest Emergency Room and drops a papoose (on the advice of "social workers" who cater to the migrant community). While she's convalescing, the social workers swoop in and sign her up WIC for her new baby, a free public housing unit and maybe even SSI since she's the mother of a new American Citizen with no visible means of support.  She doesn't tell anyone about Juan, also on the advice of social workers, so as far as Social Security, WIC, SNAP and Section 8 knows, she's a single mother of an American Citizen with no visible means of support.

Meanwhile Juan is out everyday busting his ass doing jobwork for cash money he doesn't pay taxes on, but he goes home every night to Juanita's taxpayer subsidized apartment and eats the taxpayer subsidized food that Juanita gets through SNAP.

This goes on for years and years and years until one day Juanita and Juan both get caught up in an ICE sweep and we get regaled with sympathetic "news" stories about the tamale lady who been a fixture for decades or the poor hardworking Juan just trying to make his way in America ...

Multiply Juan and Juanita by 10 or 20 million and ask yourself if they deserve to stay because they look like they work hard and haven't done anything wrong aside from stealing from the taxpayers for two decades.

Quote from: Reggie Essent on Today at 01:39:28 AMI disagree.  ALL illegal aliens must be accounted for and either removed or naturalized.  The Administration is bending over backwards to make this an ordered and peaceful process.  If they self-deport, we will give them a free flight and a stipend to hold them over and, most importantly, allow them to be put on a list for proper vetting and a legal return. If they get caught and deported by ICE, they can never return legally.

What I find disturbing and what you may not be taking into account are all the very long term illegals - people that have been here for decades yet have never taken steps to naturalize.  This clearly indicates that there is an incentive structure for these people to remain illegals.

It works something like this:  Juan and Juanita cross into the US illegally in the late 1990s.  Juanita is heavily pregnant and waddles into the nearest Emergency Room and drops a papoose (on the advice of "social workers" who cater to the migrant community). While she's convalescing, the social workers swoop in and sign her up WIC for her new baby, a free public housing unit and maybe even SSI since she's the mother of a new American Citizen with no visible means of support.  She doesn't tell anyone about Juan, also on the advice of social workers, so as far as Social Security, WIC, SNAP and Section 8 knows, she's a single mother of an American Citizen with no visible means of support.

Meanwhile Juan is out everyday busting his ass doing jobwork for cash money he doesn't pay taxes on, but he goes home every night to Juanita's taxpayer subsidized apartment and eats the taxpayer subsidized food that Juanita gets through SNAP.

This goes on for years and years and years until one day Juanita and Juan both get caught up in an ICE sweep and we get regaled with sympathetic "news" stories about the tamale lady who been a fixture for decades or the poor hardworking Juan just trying to make his way in America ...

Multiply Juan and Juanita by 10 or 20 million and ask yourself if they deserve to stay because they look like they work hard and haven't done anything wrong aside from stealing from the taxpayers for two decades.

I get what you're saying and I am certainly not advocating for any of the freeloaders, criminals or illegals who work our systems in any way.

All I am advocating for is a small measure of mercy upon those who through YEARS of hard work, community building, loyalty and pride for this nation have certainly demonstrated value far beyond their original sin.

I just cannot stomach taking someone who falls into this category and uprooting their entire life to deposit them into a country they no longer have any familiarity with. What becomes of such a person? Do they have family, friends or anyone that can help them to re-assimilate into their country of origin or do they dive into the lowest levels of poverty? What happens to any of their property accumulated while here?  if said property was obtained legally and through their own hard work at this juncture it is now US who are the criminals stealing from them.

I cannot support that. those are punishments too great to justify for the mere crime of crossing the border illegally some 10 - 15 - 20 years ago. it is a situation that the overwhelming majority of us turned a blind eye to when it benefited us and is there fore not that great a moral issue that we cannot extend mercy when mercy is warranted.

Key term. When mercy is warranted.  which I realize is probably in 1 100th of all cases -- but it does exist and therefore requires a provision to address it. A provision that does not allow for the continuance of any shenanigans which may have augmented off the books employment and a taxation free lifestyle they might have enjoyed but instead forces a new path forward complete with all of the bells and whistles that come with citizenship. The good and bad.

I would propose that if we must show up to a job site for the purpose of identifying illegals we do the necessary leg work to determine whether or not any illegal we captured falls into the category I described above. if so, we make provisions for them to begin paying taxes immediately. we also hold the employer at said jobsite accountable as well. Such an employer lived good off the land for a long time and now it is time to give the devil his due.

a due in the form of raising the salary of that illegal we just processed by at least 30% or a wage commensurate with what the proper salary for that job type should be. A fine. And a provision which requires that employer to keep this person on their employee roster for a minimum of 90 days.

you see -- right now here we are tossing human beings over the fence like garbage caring not what happens to them while allowing the element of our own society which was fostering and leveraging the illegal problem to their own benefit. no no -- in my world BOTH pay for their sins and our treasury becomes the benefactor

Quote from: Garraty_47 on Today at 01:15:09 AMI disagree with MTG's stances on most things but I respect the fact that she's willing to take principled stands on issues that set her apart from the leadership in a movement she helped define and establish. Attacking her so viciously only makes Trump look weak and desperate; it's the sort of behavior I'd expect from democrats whenever someone making progressive/populist noises gets too close to having actual influence in their party.

If you can only be "in the club" if you agree with and support Dear Leader 100% of the time, even if it means doing an about-face on your previous positions, that club starts looking an awful lot like a cult.

Same here friend. I respect and admire ANYONE of ANY party who is willing to stand up and be counted. Whether or not I agree with them is inconsequential for it is the integrity that is required of one to follow their conscience that compels my respect. I place far greater value on integrity than I do conformity because I believe that conformity will just get you the result the monolith is after whereas integrity will, more often than not, get you the result that society needs.

For instance. Justice Roberts gets a lot of heat for voting aside the democrats on several key issues. On the right he's labeled a ""traitor"" etc etc. I have never agreed with such labels. EVEN when he votes in a manner inconsistent with a belief I personally hold. I respect the fact that he is following his conscience and doing what he believes is right. And I can salute him, even without agreeing, for that.

On the flip side, I have yet to see any democrat justice vote in contradiction to whatever the monolith is promoting. And that alone tells me something stinks in that party and they should be avoided.

And most certainly agreed. Trump makes himself look like an asshole when he attacks a former ally this way. I wish he'd realize this for himself and cut the shit out

but no one is perfect I guess

QuoteWhat I find disturbing and what you may not be taking into account are all the very long term illegals - people that have been here for decades yet have never taken steps to naturalize.  This clearly indicates that there is an incentive structure for these people to remain illegals.

That is something I never understood.

Quote from: Biggie Smiles on Today at 10:05:43 AMI get what you're saying and I am certainly not advocating for any of the freeloaders, criminals or illegals who work our systems in any way.

All I am advocating for is a small measure of mercy upon those who through YEARS of hard work, community building, loyalty and pride for this nation have certainly demonstrated value far beyond their original sin.

I just cannot stomach taking someone who falls into this category and uprooting their entire life to deposit them into a country they no longer have any familiarity with. What becomes of such a person? Do they have family, friends or anyone that can help them to re-assimilate into their country of origin or do they dive into the lowest levels of poverty? What happens to any of their property accumulated while here?  if said property was obtained legally and through their own hard work at this juncture it is now US who are the criminals stealing from them.

I cannot support that. those are punishments too great to justify for the mere crime of crossing the border illegally some 10 - 15 - 20 years ago. it is a situation that the overwhelming majority of us turned a blind eye to when it benefited us and is there fore not that great a moral issue that we cannot extend mercy when mercy is warranted.

Key term. When mercy is warranted.  which I realize is probably in 1 100th of all cases -- but it does exist and therefore requires a provision to address it. A provision that does not allow for the continuance of any shenanigans which may have augmented off the books employment and a taxation free lifestyle they might have enjoyed but instead forces a new path forward complete with all of the bells and whistles that come with citizenship. The good and bad.

I would propose that if we must show up to a job site for the purpose of identifying illegals we do the necessary leg work to determine whether or not any illegal we captured falls into the category I described above. if so, we make provisions for them to begin paying taxes immediately. we also hold the employer at said jobsite accountable as well. Such an employer lived good off the land for a long time and now it is time to give the devil his due.

a due in the form of raising the salary of that illegal we just processed by at least 30% or a wage commensurate with what the proper salary for that job type should be. A fine. And a provision which requires that employer to keep this person on their employee roster for a minimum of 90 days.

you see -- right now here we are tossing human beings over the fence like garbage caring not what happens to them while allowing the element of our own society which was fostering and leveraging the illegal problem to their own benefit. no no -- in my world BOTH pay for their sins and our treasury becomes the benefactor

I see your point. Many of these people are decent and hardworking folks who made a place for themselves in our communities and built a life here.

But the open question remains:  if they have been here for literally decades and taken no steps to naturalize, we must ask ourselves why? What "incentive" exists for these long-term illegals that compells them to remain "undocumented?"

Now, I'm not talking about the 10 or 20 million that waltzed in here over the last 5 years, all of them must be removed, I'm talking about the ones that have been here for decades and have become part of our communities.  WHY are they still illegals after so many years?

It is a fact that ICE is tracking down many of these people through social safety net benefit rolls, like SSI, SNAP, Section 8 and various State-run social programs. I think this is at the heart of the incentive structure that compels illegals to remain illegal.

And as I pointed out above, this Administration is bending over backwards to offer these long-term illegals a chance to rectify their status, but it can't be a "blanket amnesty." They have to self deport to be eligible to return legally.  I'd like to see some kind of commission or review board to expedite the cases of these long-term self deportees to return to their lives here, but again, it cannot be a blanket amnesty.  That we cannot do.

Quote from: Reggie Essent on Today at 01:39:28 AMI disagree.  ALL illegal aliens must be accounted for and either removed or naturalized.  The Administration is bending over backwards to make this an ordered and peaceful process.  If they self-deport, we will give them a free flight and a stipend to hold them over and, most importantly, allow them to be put on a list for proper vetting and a legal return. If they get caught and deported by ICE, they can never return legally.

What I find disturbing and what you may not be taking into account are all the very long term illegals - people that have been here for decades yet have never taken steps to naturalize.  This clearly indicates that there is an incentive structure for these people to remain illegals.

It works something like this:  Juan and Juanita cross into the US illegally in the late 1990s.  Juanita is heavily pregnant and waddles into the nearest Emergency Room and drops a papoose (on the advice of "social workers" who cater to the migrant community). While she's convalescing, the social workers swoop in and sign her up WIC for her new baby, a free public housing unit and maybe even SSI since she's the mother of a new American Citizen with no visible means of support.  She doesn't tell anyone about Juan, also on the advice of social workers, so as far as Social Security, WIC, SNAP and Section 8 knows, she's a single mother of an American Citizen with no visible means of support.

Meanwhile Juan is out everyday busting his ass doing jobwork for cash money he doesn't pay taxes on, but he goes home every night to Juanita's taxpayer subsidized apartment and eats the taxpayer subsidized food that Juanita gets through SNAP.

This goes on for years and years and years until one day Juanita and Juan both get caught up in an ICE sweep and we get regaled with sympathetic "news" stories about the tamale lady who been a fixture for decades or the poor hardworking Juan just trying to make his way in America ...

Multiply Juan and Juanita by 10 or 20 million and ask yourself if they deserve to stay because they look like they work hard and haven't done anything wrong aside from stealing from the taxpayers for two decades.

This X1000!!! Deport every single one of these fucking rats until NONE remain!!! I know it for an irrefutable FACT! that these scumbags come here, drive wages down, they also get on cash assistance, free medical, kids go to school AND THEY PAY NOTHING INTO THE SYSTEM!!!!!!

This shit makes my fucking blood BOIL!!!!

And as far as Hobbit Toes MTG, Trump needs to put the IRS on that stupid cunt and if she's been hiring illegals, which it sounds like she has from her stupid fucking "workers" butthurt, they need to toss her in PRISON, out of Congress, and her entire business needs to be confiscated and sold off!!! Hiring illegals should really be considered treason and you should DIE, DIE, DIE!!!!

For 30 years, my source in Illinois government has been telling me these stories. FACK!!!!!!

You can tell from my comments what I think of Garraty's "dear leader" comment. Maybe focus on that stupid cunt taking advantage of slave labor at the cost of your damned tax dollars too, Garraty.

Quote from: Biggie Smiles on Today at 10:05:43 AMI get what you're saying and I am certainly not advocating for any of the freeloaders, criminals or illegals who work our systems in any way.

All I am advocating for is a small measure of mercy upon those who through YEARS of hard work, community building, loyalty and pride for this nation have certainly demonstrated value far beyond their original sin.

I just cannot stomach taking someone who falls into this category and uprooting their entire life to deposit them into a country they no longer have any familiarity with. What becomes of such a person? Do they have family, friends or anyone that can help them to re-assimilate into their country of origin or do they dive into the lowest levels of poverty? What happens to any of their property accumulated while here?  if said property was obtained legally and through their own hard work at this juncture it is now US who are the criminals stealing from them.

I cannot support that. those are punishments too great to justify for the mere crime of crossing the border illegally some 10 - 15 - 20 years ago. it is a situation that the overwhelming majority of us turned a blind eye to when it benefited us and is there fore not that great a moral issue that we cannot extend mercy when mercy is warranted.

Key term. When mercy is warranted.  which I realize is probably in 1 100th of all cases -- but it does exist and therefore requires a provision to address it. A provision that does not allow for the continuance of any shenanigans which may have augmented off the books employment and a taxation free lifestyle they might have enjoyed but instead forces a new path forward complete with all of the bells and whistles that come with citizenship. The good and bad.

I would propose that if we must show up to a job site for the purpose of identifying illegals we do the necessary leg work to determine whether or not any illegal we captured falls into the category I described above. if so, we make provisions for them to begin paying taxes immediately. we also hold the employer at said jobsite accountable as well. Such an employer lived good off the land for a long time and now it is time to give the devil his due.

a due in the form of raising the salary of that illegal we just processed by at least 30% or a wage commensurate with what the proper salary for that job type should be. A fine. And a provision which requires that employer to keep this person on their employee roster for a minimum of 90 days.

you see -- right now here we are tossing human beings over the fence like garbage caring not what happens to them while allowing the element of our own society which was fostering and leveraging the illegal problem to their own benefit. no no -- in my world BOTH pay for their sins and our treasury becomes the benefactor

They stole from us. For decades in many cases. DEPORT!!!!!

Here I was, living like a third worlder, driving a POS car so my kids could all attend private school while these rat cocksuckers lived off my damned tax dollars!