We need well rounded liberals…

[Dove]

In all honesty tho



"well rounded" libs fall into 1 of 2 categories



1. The libs who are smart enough to realize their party promotes absolute shit and would rather not debate the subject because they know their party's positions are unsustainable. And only remain on the left due to the fact that they are still clinging to 1950's era liberal ideologies. -- Think Vitty a.k.a Gerraty47 and Bonesaw

Not bitching but I do want to clear up an apparent misconception:



I'm not a democrat.

Never been a democrat.

Since the 1980s I've never voted for a democrat or republican for president and I voted in all of the major elections as well as almost all of the mid-terms/specials.



I've voted in exactly two presidential primaries- 2016 and 2020.

Both times for Bernie (in Virginia you don't have to be a card-carrying party member to vote in primaries).



As far as I'm concerned the democrats are right-wing because, well, because they demonstrably are.

In any other nation on Earth the democrats would be, at best, center-right.

Which ironically is why I consider them even worse than republicans.



The democrats make "progressive" noises and claim to support "progressive" issues when they need some votes but it's all bullshit.

As soon as they're elected that shit goes straight out the window.



Obama was the worst.

He set a record for how fast he went from "On day one I'll do the thing" while campaigning to "That's not a priority" as soon as his ass was in the chair.

He was just as much a tool of wall street as any other politician and an even bigger warmonger than Bush Jr. (although he's a close second with a couple of astonishingly stupid wars).



As bad as Shrub was it was Obummer who suspended habeas corpus, took us from 2 wars to 7, and initiated a drone program that killed far more innocent civilians than "terrorists".



Why would I want to associate myself with a party like that?

Ha! Trick question... of course I wouldn't.

LoL

 Not bitching either or anything.....just trying to communicate effectively here...



 Could maybe define "right wing"?  Because there is a huge discrepancy in how right wingers describe right wing and this calling the democrats "right wing" thing. It's really weird seeing dems called right wing.



 Because the way we see it, hardly any of them have been truly right wing. Too much government, too much regulation and too much war mongering.



 I even voted for Obama in 2008 and it's embarrassing. He promised to bring people home and end the conflict and he slaughtered innocent people and made it vastly worse. Just a big piece of shit.

[Dove]

Yeah we haven't really had any even on the Republican end in a while.



https://www.diffen.com/difference/Left_Wing_vs_Right_Wing">https://www.diffen.com/difference/Left_ ... Right_Wing">https://www.diffen.com/difference/Left_Wing_vs_Right_Wing

[Biggie Smiles]

In all honesty tho



"well rounded" libs fall into 1 of 2 categories



1. The libs who are smart enough to realize their party promotes absolute shit and would rather not debate the subject because they know their party's positions are unsustainable. And only remain on the left due to the fact that they are still clinging to 1950's era liberal ideologies. -- Think Vitty a.k.a Gerraty47 and Bonesaw

Not bitching but I do want to clear up an apparent misconception:



I'm not a democrat.

Never been a democrat.

Since the 1980s I've never voted for a democrat or republican for president and I voted in all of the major elections as well as almost all of the mid-terms/specials.



I've voted in exactly two presidential primaries- 2016 and 2020.

Both times for Bernie (in Virginia you don't have to be a card-carrying party member to vote in primaries).



As far as I'm concerned the democrats are right-wing because, well, because they demonstrably are.

In any other nation on Earth the democrats would be, at best, center-right.

Which ironically is why I consider them even worse than republicans.



The democrats make "progressive" noises and claim to support "progressive" issues when they need some votes but it's all bullshit.

As soon as they're elected that shit goes straight out the window.



Obama was the worst.

He set a record for how fast he went from "On day one I'll do the thing" while campaigning to "That's not a priority" as soon as his ass was in the chair.

He was just as much a tool of wall street as any other politician and an even bigger warmonger than Bush Jr. (although he's a close second with a couple of astonishingly stupid wars).



As bad as Shrub was it was Obummer who suspended habeas corpus, took us from 2 wars to 7, and initiated a drone program that killed far more innocent civilians than "terrorists".



Why would I want to associate myself with a party like that?

Ha! Trick question... of course I wouldn't.

LoL

gotcha.



But you are left tho.



But anyway, what are your honest thoughts on the progressive darling AOC?



From where I'm sitting the only person she's benefited during her time in office is herself



Bernie is not far behind but not as god awfully bad in my opinion

[DKG]

AOC has been in congress for four years and still has no idea where the money is spent. Bernie Sanders has been in Washington for thirty two years and has no idea where the money is spent.

[Garraty_47]

 Not bitching either or anything.....just trying to communicate effectively here...



 Could maybe define "right wing"?  Because there is a huge discrepancy in how right wingers describe right wing and this calling the democrats "right wing" thing. It's really weird seeing dems called right wing.

They campaign on "progressive" issues like health care, the environment, etc. but they govern exactly the opposite.



Obummer went from promising -literally promising- a public health care option to giving us a scaled-up republican think tank (Heritage Foundation, I think?) program (ACA) test-driven by Mittenz Romney in his state.



The democrats pass bills they say are "environmental" that REQUIRE more fossil fuel exploration and extraction.



From where *I* stand (and compared to the policies/behaviors of politicians in other countries) the democrats are undeniably to not just my right but to *the* right.



Decades of moving the "centrist" goal post farther and farther to the right has left the democrat party staking out positions that would have been more "conservative" than by-gone republicans like Reagan, even.



The democrats may be to the left of you but they are in no way shape or form "the left".

[DKG]

I disagree with all the definitions Americans have of right and left and progressive. All are disningenuous.



Left wing is progressive and progressive is taking away choice on fossil fuel production and usage. That is authoritarianism. Taking away abortion choice is not right wing, it's authoritarianism.  Authoritarianism knows no political spectrum.

[Biggie Smiles]

 Not bitching either or anything.....just trying to communicate effectively here...



 Could maybe define "right wing"?  Because there is a huge discrepancy in how right wingers describe right wing and this calling the democrats "right wing" thing. It's really weird seeing dems called right wing.

They campaign on "progressive" issues like health care, the environment, etc. but they govern exactly the opposite.



Obummer went from promising -literally promising- a public health care option to giving us a scaled-up republican think tank (Heritage Foundation, I think?) program (ACA) test-driven by Mittenz Romney in his state.



The democrats pass bills they say are "environmental" that REQUIRE more fossil fuel exploration and extraction.



From where *I* stand (and compared to the policies/behaviors of politicians in other countries) the democrats are undeniably to not just my right but to *the* right.



Decades of moving the "centrist" goal post farther and farther to the right has left the democrat party staking out positions that would have been more "conservative" than by-gone republicans like Reagan, even.



The democrats may be to the left of you but they are in no way shape or form "the left".

Democrats appease the idiots in their base that simply have no idea how the world works by saying "we're not drilling in the US anymore"



woopty doo. We live on a fucking SPHERE and they're simply asking other countries with LESS REGULATIONS and lagging technology to drill for oil instead. Doing X times the damage



great fucking accomplishment



this world isn't ready for a civilization without fossil fuel and until we are FUCK THE ENVIRONMENT -- we're too heavily entrenched in the reliance of fossil fuels to do otherwise

[Garraty_47]

But anyway, what are your honest thoughts on the progressive darling AOC?

AOC is only beloved of fauxgressives, or shitlibs, or whatever you want to call them.

The kind of people who watch Bill Maher or Rachel Maddow and think they're getting informed instead of propagandized.



AOC's a performative wannabe celebrity who lies for a living.

When I look at her I see Nancy Pelosi about a hundred years ago.

AOC wants to be "Momma Bear" some day and she'll do whatever it takes to get there.

In the democrat party that means doing whatever the donor class and/or the pentagon wants and saying whatever hollow bullshit required to keep getting elected.



She and Bernie are both happy in their roles as judas goats... luring in or appropriating "progressive" movements and voters to be isolated, neutralized, and ultimately absorbed into the establishment democrat collective.



For a while I hoped Bernie would be different but after allowing the DNC to railroad him two elections in a row I now see that he was never interested in leading a movement anywhere except into the arms of the wholly corrupt democrat party.



Fuck that guy, and fuck AOC too.

[DKG]

Progressives like AOC and Bernie want a no competition failed public health care system like Canada has. The only other country that doesn't allow a competing private health care alternative is North Korea. Progressivism, authoritarianism are two sides of the same coin.

[Erica Mena]

Ahhhh Vitty is the breath of fresh air that we've been needing.

[Biggie Smiles]

But anyway, what are your honest thoughts on the progressive darling AOC?

AOC is only beloved of fauxgressives, or shitlibs, or whatever you want to call them.

The kind of people who watch Bill Maher or Rachel Maddow and think they're getting informed instead of propagandized.



AOC's a performative wannabe celebrity who lies for a living.

When I look at her I see Nancy Pelosi about a hundred years ago.

AOC wants to be "Momma Bear" some day and she'll do whatever it takes to get there.

In the democrat party that means doing whatever the donor class and/or the pentagon wants and saying whatever hollow bullshit required to keep getting elected.



She and Bernie are both happy in their roles as judas goats... luring in or appropriating "progressive" movements and voters to be isolated, neutralized, and ultimately absorbed into the establishment democrat collective.



For a while I hoped Bernie would be different but after allowing the DNC to railroad him two elections in a row I now see that he was never interested in leading a movement anywhere except into the arms of the wholly corrupt democrat party.



Fuck that guy, and fuck AOC too.

You see now you're sounding like a person who would support Trump



while far from perfect Trump was a hell of a lot better than the shitbags mentioned above and those running the establishment today

[Biggie Smiles]

Progressives like AOC and Bernie want a no competition failed public health care system like Canada has. The only other country that doesn't allow a competing private health care alternative is North Korea. Progressivism, authoritarianism are two sides of the same coin.

It's no secret I work in the IT industry as a consultant.



About a month ago and a half ago I was assisting a customer with setting up an IPSEC based VPN tunnel with a government agency that provided some type of niche service to this company. Don't exactly recall what but that's not germane to the story-line



what is germane is that it took 18 fucking days and about 30 calls, emails and letters to get someone in their IT department to provide a few simple settings such as encryption type, sha values etc etc. Could have been done in 5 minutes. And had it been a company with competition to contend with it would have



And THAT (the quality hall monitor baked into capitalism by default) which is what propelled the US into world super power status in the first place.

[Dove]

 Not bitching either or anything.....just trying to communicate effectively here...



 Could maybe define "right wing"?  Because there is a huge discrepancy in how right wingers describe right wing and this calling the democrats "right wing" thing. It's really weird seeing dems called right wing.

They campaign on "progressive" issues like health care, the environment, etc. but they govern exactly the opposite.



Obummer went from promising -literally promising- a public health care option to giving us a scaled-up republican think tank (Heritage Foundation, I think?) program (ACA) test-driven by Mittenz Romney in his state.



The democrats pass bills they say are "environmental" that REQUIRE more fossil fuel exploration and extraction.



From where *I* stand (and compared to the policies/behaviors of politicians in other countries) the democrats are undeniably to not just my right but to *the* right.



Decades of moving the "centrist" goal post farther and farther to the right has left the democrat party staking out positions that would have been more "conservative" than by-gone republicans like Reagan, even.



The democrats may be to the left of you but they are in no way shape or form "the left".

 I think it's funny how we both feel offended by the democrats being associated with our respective sides of the spectrum lol.



 None of us want them  



 I appreciate the Democrats being left of us but right of you. That makes sense.  I've had such bad experiences with those who consider themselves "left" is kinda hard for me to think of you as a lefty.  If only they were all as easy to talk to but so many take everything in such bad faith.

[DKG]

Ahhhh Vitty is the breath of fresh air that we've been needing.

I wholeheartedly agree. I have been waiting for a left wing or progressive poster who is not an Admin, Lotus or Oscar shit posting idiot since easterbunny departed. Good work getting him here.

[Erica Mena]

Ahhhh Vitty is the breath of fresh air that we've been needing.

I wholeheartedly agree. I have been waiting for a left wing or progressive poster who is not an Admin, Lotus or Oscar shit posting idiot since easterbunny departed. Good work getting him here.

I wish I could take credit. He isn't here cuz if my charming self lol