What KILLS a FORUM

[RW]

Seoul, I don't believe for one hot second profit margins are as razor thin as you're letting in.  I have seen my inheritance grow substantially in the form of Apple stock amount others.  Someone is getting rich off globalization and those jobs will not return.  We are going to see fewer jobs as automation and computerization take over human work.  That will be the next folly of man.



My point about immigration is people are bitching about it when you're exactly right.  We need to maintain and grow populations to support our aging ones.  Without immigration, we would shrink.  My point was about the perception of immigration as being a bad thing and that, IMHO, is tied to prosperity or lack thereof.  To bitch about it is symptomatic and has nothing to do with the actual problem.

[Anonymous]

Reading Scouse, IHJ and RW each put their own ideological spin on this has me rolling my eyes.



Immigration- some of you may think that it lowers wages and increases competition for labour. But, both Canada and Britain are aged societies that have made certain guarantees to their people. This includes things like health care, and state pensions. With fewer workers paying for those items and more people collecting for longer periods of time, I shouldn't have to explain the math to you. If you want less immigrants, you must settle for less services. It's really that simple.



Trade/Globalization- the idea was good. We set up some factories overseas, build a middle class in those countries and they in turn will buy from us. Most overseas factories moved to China because they hoped to eventually sell to that vast market. But, China is not interested in playing by our rules nor a win win situation. Hindsight being twenty twenty, most industrial enterprises would never move to to China today. The issue is not greed, profit margins in China are razor thin. Many would like to leave China, but that would mean writing off hundreds of billions in capital investments.



I should add how dangerous it is for one country to control global production. If there ever was a conflict in the world where the West and China were on opposite sides, they could bring us to our knees in a few weeks.



IHJ, about  your union. If they are not representing you than fire them. Get your fellow union members together and decertify them in a vote. There are plenty of trade unions around that would be happy to take your money.

That is so true Seoul..



My uncle just retired after running a factory in Dongguan China for over twenty years..



He has said that he and his partners would've stayed in Taiwan had they known what would eventually happen..



If they moved back now they would lose everything and have to start from scratch..



But, it's not just China that isn't playing fair with North America..



Japan, Korea and Taiwan have not reciprocated by opening their markets to foreign products.

[Anonymous]

Seoul, I don't believe for one hot second profit margins are as razor thin as you're letting in.  I have seen my inheritance grow substantially in the form of Apple stock amount others.  Someone is getting rich off globalization and those jobs will not return.  We are going to see fewer jobs as automation and computerization take over human work.  That will be the next folly of man.



My point about immigration is people are bitching about it when you're exactly right.  We need to maintain and grow populations to support our aging ones.  Without immigration, we would shrink.  My point was about the perception of immigration as being a bad thing and that, IMHO, is tied to prosperity or lack thereof.  To bitch about it is symptomatic and has nothing to do with the actual problem.

First of all,  what I said about immigration was for those two xenophobes, iron horse jockey and Scouse.



What I said about manufacturing in China is absolutely true. In Chinese manufacturing, margins are razor thin. Take Xiaomi, which is the largest producer in China of smartphones. They had a paltry operating margin of just 1.8% last year. Apple's  success has little to do  with manufacturing in China.



The real reasons Apple makes iPhones in China, therefore, are as follows:



Most of the components of iPhones and iPads — the supply chain — are now manufactured in China, so assembling the phones half-a-world away would create huge logistical challenges. It would also reduce flexibility — the ability to switch easily from one component supplier or manufacturer to another.

China's factories are now far bigger and more nimble than those in the United States. They can hire (and fire) tens of thousands of workers practically overnight. Because so many of the workers live on-site, they can also press them into service at a moment's notice. And they can change production practices and speeds extremely rapidly.

China now has a far bigger supply of appropriately-qualified engineers than the U.S. does — folks with the technical skills necessary to build complex gadgets but not so credentialed that they cost too much.

And, lastly, China's workforce is much hungrier and more frugal than many of their counterparts in the United States.



Apple doesn't build iPhones in the United States, because there is no longer an ecosystem there to support that manufacturing. There are many countries with lower wages than China, but China owns the entire electronics supply chain now.

[realgrimm]

 

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[IRISH KAM]

 

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